Wiki Discussion and Proposed Changes Thread

[Johnny_Madhouse 28]

Thank you! Editing. I haven't gotten out of the stone age, I thought there were a few more put into an ingot when I started smelting.

You were probably using small ores from your sluices and most surface rocks, not the regular ones you get from mining.

[Deathbytac0 46]

You were probably using small ores from your sluices and most surface rocks, not the regular ones you get from mining.

Yeah.

[flamestrider 35]

I'm writing a thing for the currently blank altitude page on the wiki. As far I know, the only effect altitude has on the player is that fires burn hotter at higher elevations (which is weird, as there should be less oxygen and the cold temperatures and higher humidity at high altitudes should make fuel less combustible). Is there anything else?

the only effect altitude currently has on heat in general is that bloomeries lose heat if they are below a certain height. forges and fire pits lost the effect from height in 45 or 46.

See, that's interesting, because I made a bunch of firepits in creative mode at different elevations and tested that. All firepits were fed by the same wood (oak) and all firepits had a completely clear area above them. Then I waited to see what temperature they would stabilize at. There wasn't much of a temperature difference, but it was noticeable. You can test this for yourself and see if your results match mine. I was a little confused by my results!

were the ambient temperatures different? cuz i think altitude affects temperature, which affects burning heat. bioxx was "supposed" to have removed altitude from the fire heat equation.

In the coming build 48 Bioxx is removing the altitude-effect from the firepit entirely, see his notes on the change log.

Unified some fire related code in order to simplify bug fixing. As a result the Firepit is no longer affected by height. This was also done because people did not understand why this was added in the first place.

[flamestrider 35]

reworked the anvil template a bit to make the grid fit better, redid the sword and mace pages to contain all the needed information and links. Me and Kreicus redid the armor page to make it less "scroll" and more read, among other things

[kelik 10]

reworked the anvil template a bit to make the grid fit better, redid the sword and mace pages to contain all the needed information and links. Me and Kreicus redid the armor page to make it less "scroll" and more read, among other things

i just looked over the pages mentioned and i have to say... well done, guys!

[GCountach 39]

The more I look at both pages, the more I wonder.... why is there a "Getting Started" page and a "No nonsense, a stone-age guide"? Both pages seem to be used to introduce new players to TFC game and mechanics and there seems to be a lot of redundent information. The stone-age guide seems to be more aligned with the tone and form of the wiki, but both are actively updated. Seems a merging of the two would be benefical.

[flamestrider 35]

The reason I started building the stone age guide was because I got scared when I saw the wall of text that the getting started guide. I wanted to create a more approachable and readable guide to introduce new people into the world of terrafirma. And one reason I never touched the getting started guide was because I dislike altering someone elses guide, since those are a bit more personal than the other types of information pages on the wiki.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

I'm writing a thing for the currently blank altitude page on the wiki. As far I know, the only effect altitude has on the player is that fires burn hotter at higher elevations (which is weird, as there should be less oxygen and the cold temperatures and higher humidity at high altitudes should make fuel less combustible). Is there anything else?

It was assumed higher winds = more oxygen.

[flamestrider 35]

It was assumed higher winds = more oxygen.

That was how i viewed it as well, but no big deal any more since in build 48 it goes away...

[Kreicus 46]

Personally I think the 'getting started' guide should be removed completely (sorry to who was updating it). The information on that page was sooooooooooo outdated I figured it would be easier just to do a whole re-write. As of this time, I think the stone-age guide is much more complete and up to date. I had suggested to flamestrider that having 2 pages of the same thing was confusing and the old one should be removed, but only a day or two after it started getting updated.

I guess DeathbyTac0 is the one updating it? I'd suggest getting his opinion on this...

[Axis 1]

I apologize for just jumping head-first into editing, I probably should have consulted here first ehehehehoops

1. I noticed for almost all the icons of ingots, double ingots, and the unshaped forms of whatever metal (including the 150px version for ingots) is the excess of stray white pixels. It's not so easy to notice most of the time, unless the pictures are on a darker background, like when used in a crafting recipe or something. It just looks a little bit messy in my opinion, that's all.

2. The information on the stone pages are a bit scattered and, in my opinion (which is very biased, sorry folks), just hard to read.

Ripping this off of the "Phyllite" page as of now.

"Phyllite is a light gray colored rock found as Smooth Phyllite in the world. When mined It drops a Cobblestone version of its self.

The cobble stone version can be used to create a Forge or It can be crafted into a Stone Hammer, Stone Prospector's Pick, Stone Pickaxe,Stone Shovel, Stone Hoe, Stone Axe, Bone Pickaxe, Bone Shovel, Bone Hoe and a Bone Axe.

In its Smooth form it can be used as a decorative block, but in Its Brick form it can be used to make a Bloomery at any time in Your Journey"

I don't know, to me yes it offers the basic information (can it be crafted into ___? yes okay), but the capitalization and whatnot is just out of whack. I've been going through about one third of the rock pages rewording these info sections. Also, what's the deal with "cobblestone"? Can we just say "rock" or is that not how it works? I always assumed the two were synonymous.

3. There are a few images that aren't loading (I'm assuming it's not a problem just for me, but I don't know), and I made a little sandbox page with a scrolly doodad of a list of images I found to be missing. Buuuut if that's not the case, then no need to make any changes.

in a nutshell: metal images, rock pages, and various other images

[GCountach 39]

Some uniform naming would be handy in that regard. I've seen the items you get for mining out stone as cobblestone, rock, and stone. Seems rock is or my opinion should be the proper name. It only exists in cobblestone form when placed and stone is what you're mining into to obtain the rock. Also, I think it's planned that cobblestone will require extra steps to create (beyond just right-clicking with rock in hand).

From the beta 40 changelog:

Mining Raw Stone no longer gives cobblestone blocks. Instead it drops rock items. For now these rock items when used in the world will spawn a cobblestone block(If I ever get to overhauling construction, it will take several of these for a single cobble block).

Though the change log does seem to use stone and rock interchangeably, but for the purpose of clarification, I think it should be the raw, unmined blocks are stone, items you retrieve when mining out stone are rocks, and the blocks you place (and eventually may have to craft) are cobblestone.

[Chezzik 22]

I was just thinking about what updates I think are needed. I'll try to make a list:

1) Clay (Item) needs a page with an image of clay blocks in the wild. I spent a couple hours looking for Vanilla-style clay before realizing that it has a different texture in this mod. Here's a picture that could work, that I found with a quick google search, or I could make one. Please spare new players of this pain!

2) Unshaped Copper claims that it can be smelted in a firepit. I tried dense woods and peat for fuel, and tried bellows, and still failed to get this to work. I think it's just out of date.

3) Dacite doesn't list Native Copper as possible vein, but that's where I found a copper vein last night. I'm not sure if this is just a random mistake, or if all the ore/stone relationships have changed.

4) Pages for individual stone types (like Dacite for example) say that they can be used for making a prospector's pick. Propicks are metal only now.

5) The second image in bulding a sluice channel indicates that you need air blocks to the left and right of the sluice. The inverse is actually true. If you build it with air blocks like this, the sluice will not work.

6) Pickaxe durability and speed for each type of metal is not found on any page. I'd like the exact numbers, if the developers don't mind us decompiling the class files. My assumption is that higher tier metals have better speed and durability, but couldn't find any page that actually confirms this.

7) Log#Crafting shows logs going straight to planks, without mentioning the "plank" stage.

8) I think a page on Cave-Ins would be justified, showing examples of what is safe and what isn't. It should also mention that ore is destroyed if it falls during a cave-in.

The charcoal pit page obviously needs a rewrite, but it says this at the top, so clearly its known.

I know there were a few other larger issues that I found, but I'm not recalling them at this time.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

I was just thinking about what updates I think are needed. I'll try to make a list:

1) Clay (Item) needs a page with an image of clay blocks in the wild. I spent a couple hours looking for Vanilla-style clay before realizing that it has a different texture in this mod. Here's a picture that could work, that I found with a quick google search, or I could make one. Please spare new players of this pain!

2) Unshaped Copper claims that it can be smelted in a firepit. I tried dense woods and peat for fuel, and tried bellows, and still failed to get this to work. I think it's just out of date.

3) Dacite doesn't list Native Copper as possible vein, but that's where I found a copper vein last night. I'm not sure if this is just a random mistake, or if all the ore/stone relationships have changed.

4) Pages for individual stone types (like Dacite for example) say that they can be used for making a prospector's pick. Propicks are metal only now.

5) The second image in bulding a sluice channel indicates that you need air blocks to the left and right of the sluice. The inverse is actually true. If you build it with air blocks like this, the sluice will not work.

6) Pickaxe durability and speed for each type of metal is not found on any page. I'd like the exact numbers, if the developers don't mind us decompiling the class files. My assumption is that higher tier metals have better speed and durability, but couldn't find any page that actually confirms this.

7) Log#Crafting shows logs going straight to planks, without mentioning the "plank" stage.

8) I think a page on Cave-Ins would be justified, showing examples of what is safe and what isn't. It should also mention that ore is destroyed if it falls during a cave-in.

The charcoal pit page obviously needs a rewrite, but it says this at the top, so clearly its known.

I know there were a few other larger issues that I found, but I'm not recalling them at this time.

I was able to smelt copper in a firepit using 2+ bellows and hickory.

as far as #6 goes, we do not allow it at all. It's a secret.

[Chezzik 22]

I was able to smelt copper in a firepit using 2+ bellows and hickory.

Ok, I thought of trying two bellows, but knew that I couldn't be holding right click on both, so I thought it would make no difference.

Now I'm realizing that "holding right click" was probably not actuating the bellows 5+ times per second, even if the animation looked that way!

as far as #6 goes, we do not allow it at all. It's a secret.

[GCountach 39]

1) Clay (Item) needs a page with an image of clay blocks in the wild. I spent a couple hours looking for Vanilla-style clay before realizing that it has a different texture in this mod. Here's a picture that could work, that I found with a quick google search, or I could make one. Please spare new players of this pain!

I recognize that picture! Given the trouble I've seen with new players finding clay, I would say this is a good idea. I'll work on that page if no one else does first. Page created!

Unshaped Copper claims that it can be smelted in a firepit. I tried dense woods and peat for fuel, and tried bellows, and still failed to get this to work. I think it's just out of date.

As dunk already said, copper can be done in a firepit, but it's a pain. The information is correct, however.

3) Dacite doesn't list Native Copper as possible vein, but that's where I found a copper vein last night. I'm not sure if this is just a random mistake, or if all the ore/stone relationships have changed.

The ore spawning algorithm has changed in 47. How much so isn't exactly certain as of yet, but there's a post HERE that is asking your help in figuring that out. If you could read and contribute to that thread, it would be much appreciated.

4) Pages for individual stone types (like Dacite for example) say that they can be used for making a prospector's pick. Propicks are metal only now.

You're correct and I have changed this now. Thanks!

5) The second image in bulding a sluice channel indicates that you need air blocks to the left and right of the sluice. The inverse is actually true. If you build it with air blocks like this, the sluice will not work.

The second image is the layer above the layer the sluice is placed in. If you look at the third picture, which is the layer that the sluice is placed in, the dirt blocks you are mentioning are there. The diagram is a bit confusing, but correct.

6) Pickaxe durability and speed for each type of metal is not found on any page. I'd like the exact numbers, if the developers don't mind us decompiling the class files. My assumption is that higher tier metals have better speed and durability, but couldn't find any page that actually confirms this.

As mentioned, giving exact numbers like these are not allowed in the wiki.

7) Log#Crafting shows logs going straight to planks, without mentioning the "plank" stage.

Indeed it does. I'll fix it if no one beats me to it. Fixed. Thanks!

I think a page on Cave-Ins would be justified, showing examples of what is safe and what isn't. It should also mention that ore is destroyed if it falls during a cave-in.

I'd write such a page, but frankly I'm not a cave-in expert. I'll leave that to someone who is. Though the ore bit I'm not sure about. It seems to ignore physics, doesn't it? I do know I can mine out ores all day without mining out the stone connected to it and it won't cave-in on me. Not sure if it's intended or not, but that's how it is. Edited 22 Aug 2012 by GCountach

[Chezzik 22]

I thought of a couple others:

Forge should state that "any ingots that reach liquid stage are immediately lost unless a fresh ceramic mold exists to catch it." The page already says that the slots on the right exist for ceramic molds, but I think that more text is justified here.

Community portal (seen as a link on the left side of every page) is empty. It should probably redirect to the forums.

~~~

The wiki is looking good! A functioning wiki greatly improves the experience for any new players

[flamestrider 35]

I thought of a couple others:

Forge should state that "any ingots that reach liquid stage are immediately lost unless a fresh ceramic mold exists to catch it." The page already says that the slots on the right exist for ceramic molds, but I think that more text is justified here.

Community portal (seen as a link on the left side of every page) is empty. It should probably redirect to the forums.

~~~

The wiki is looking good! A functioning wiki greatly improves the experience for any new players

Added the warning to the "Using your Forge"-part of the forge page.

[Ragnarok 0]

Several of the newer features are missing documentation. We need to add a mobs index, containing pages on deer and bears. We also need to add an agriculture index with a page for each of the innumerable farmable plants that bioxx has added in the latest version.

[Kreicus 46]

Several of the newer features are missing documentation. We need to add a mobs index, containing pages on deer and bears. We also need to add an agriculture index with a page for each of the innumerable farmable plants that bioxx has added in the latest version.

It's not even been 24hours! And most of us are waiting to update till small bugs are sorted.

I'll look at some of these things as well and see what I can update.

[flamestrider 35]

Several of the newer features are missing documentation. We need to add a mobs index, containing pages on deer and bears. We also need to add an agriculture index with a page for each of the innumerable farmable plants that bioxx has added in the latest version.

It's not even been 24hours! And most of us are waiting to update till small bugs are sorted.

I'll look at some of these things as well and see what I can update.

Make a new page on the wiki, I call it Agriculture http://wiki.terrafirmacraft.com/Agriculture

Hope you all will like it.

[Kreicus 46]

Question:

On the main page, there are 2 notable columns, Gameplay and Useful Page. I think Useful Pages is good, it has many popular pages for quick access. But Gameplay seems to be a jumble of many different types of pages...

It seems there are two distinct types of pages under Gameplay:

• Guides
• New Mechanics

Guides could include; no nonsense, a stone-age guide; spotter's guide; video-tutorials and let's plays; getting started

New Mechanics could include; agriculture; knapping; forge; bloomery.

These 4 mechanics require a many different steps to accomplish other then just crafting an item, it would make sense for them to be in a section together

2 pages not included here are the plans page, which i think would be better off in the useful pages section, and the construction page, which i dont see as being very useful, most of that info is within the respected tool used in construction, but if ya'll think it's a mechanic it can go there as well.

Anyways, I just thought to maybe split up the first column into 1 column with 2 rows, one with Guides as a heading the other with New Mechanics as a heading.

It's just rearranging the items, so nothing huge, but since it's on the main page, i wanted to look for opinions here.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

there's now a page for mobs in general, but not much is on it.

Yeah, so I suck at editing wikis. Someone who's good, can you update all the animal stuff and make it look good? If anything is slightly wrong, I can fix it. (I can't expect you guys to figure out stuff I haven't told anyone, but I hope you can do your best )

[kelik 10]

wow guys, sorry for the leave of absence,i'm glad that this topic finally picked up popularity. tomorrow after work when i have more time i'm going to properly update the OP and do some work on the wiki. thanks for all of your suggestions and contributions. keep em coming!

[Scooterdanny 285]

I would like to see the agriculture page updated, with information we didn't have from the changelog, so far it looks good though1