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    • Crysyn

      Only help if you can be helpful

      Hey All, A topic has come up of late in the IRC channel in regards to the general feel of the forums and the community that supports them. Things have progressed further than I would have liked with out this being addressed more publicly because I would much rather have snubbed this out sooner rather than later.. but I have been busy. Here is the general rule I would like people to follow: Wheaton's Law "Don't be a dick." Those of you from the IRC channel know that this is the only rule I ask people in there to follow and we generally have a good and lively time chatting about all manner of things. This is basic rule that just about everyone understands and I am going to expand it to the forums from here moving forward. If you can not help people in a helpful and polite manner then I simply ask you to stop. Now I generally take a back seat to moderating the forums as I like to participate in the suggestions forum fairly heavily at times and would rather do so as a forums user than a moderator. But I am also fairly well known for being the person who constantly puts their foot down and so I am stepping up and doing so on here. If you find yourself unable to respond to a message politely then I ask that you do not respond. This mostly focuses on the increasing level of hostility found within the Suggestion forum as well as the Server forum. I do not care if this is the 30th some odd time you have seen someone make the same suggestion. Or even if the new post on an older topic is one entry above the old one. I expect the members of this forum to respond politely to the user, new or old, and point to the older topic if it applies and even go the extra step to suggest they either add in new information or to summarize the outcome of the previous discussion based upon the new post's entry into it. That is what we are here for, that is why I close most topics instead of deleting them, so that they can be found and referenced down the road. The next topic is the slew of derailment attempts I have seen as of late. If you want to have fun and joke around that is what the off topic forum is for and pretty much anything goes there. I do not expect to read a suggestion thread and have to go through 3 pages of image memes people have shot back and forth. Quite simply this is a waste of my time to read and then have to clean up. Now for the summary. I am going to start taking a more active role, especially in policing the suggestion forum, and handing out warn levels to people whom I see doing this. These will be indiscriminate and applied not to just the first person who derails or is impolite on a topic or response, but to everyone whom follows the lead of that person. As I do not like doing things with out giving you all warning this post shall serve as that warning. If you have a desire to bring this topic up with me then I invite you to do so on the IRC channel. Lets raise the level of quality and grow the community. Let us not descend into the quality often found on the minecraft or league of legend forums. There is simply no need for that here. Be passionate about things, just do not be abusive.
    • Kittychanley

      Offline Servers

      Recently I've seen a few server listings showing up on the first page of the Servers forum that have been closed for an extended period of time, but have recently gotten a reply from a new member who didn't realize the server is offline. To help prevent this from happening in the future, it would be greatly appreciated if you could use the report function on the original post of any servers that have been confirmed as offline, so that the topic may be locked. If you are the admin of a server and plan on taking the server offline, please use the report function on the original post of your topic to let the TFC Staff know that the topic should be locked. If you are the admin of a server that has a locked topic, and would wish to bring the server back online, please use the report function on the original post of the topic to let the TFC Staff know that the topic should be unlocked. As always, please remember to follow rule #3 of the servers forum and update your topic title to contain the version of TFC that the server is currently running. You can do so by editing the OP, and then clicking on "Use Full Editor."
Maga

Better Forest Fires

11 posts in this topic

Just a quick idea.

 

I'm not sure if this is buried in the code somewhere already but if it's not I think it would make a really cool addition.

 

Now that in 79 random grass block ticking actually creates saplings like it's supposed to, it's very easy for a forest to become overgrown over the course of several years. Nature takes care of this by allowing the increased risk of fire in dense old growth to clear away the old and make way for the new. I was wondering if it would be feasible to make fire spread affected by the general "wetness" of an area. Back in the good old days when fire spread forever in early mine craft beta you were terrified of this natural disaster. Now it's no big deal. Imagine, no rain in an area?... live in fear of ravaging infernoes sweeping the landscape. If you've just been throw a few days/weeks of rain fire spread would be nerfed in that area so that there is no cause for concern and the fire only makes it a few blocks. Dry trees and grass burn much easier than wet ones.  Is this possible?

 

I just figured that since the forest can now regenerate itself there should be a way for it to naturally clear up a little too.

 

 

EDIT:

 

Idea for new bucket mechanic: Using a wooden bucket (because metal ones place source blocks) right clicking a full water bucket would remove fire blocks in a 3x3 or 5x5 area centered on the block you right clicked.

 

If there is no block then shift+right clicking the full bucket in mid-air will have the same effect, but centered on the player, or perhaps one or two blocks ahead of them.

 

This is simply a way for players to not be completely helpless against the inferno, and I think it fits with the style of TFC.

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1.) Is this suggestion based off of speculation, or are you actually observing overgrown forests taking over?

 

2.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, why would a solution based off humidity be a good thing? Wouldn't the problem continue to exist in wet areas, while making it difficuult for trees to survive in areas where there would already be less trees and not have the overpopulation problem?

 

3.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, wouldn't changing the time of growth or sapling failure chances be better options?

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1.) Is this suggestion based off of speculation, or are you actually observing overgrown forests taking over?

 

2.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, why would a solution based off humidity be a good thing? Wouldn't the problem continue to exist in wet areas, while making it difficuult for trees to survive in areas where there would already be less trees and not have the overpopulation problem?

 

3.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, wouldn't changing the time of growth or sapling failure chances be better options?

 

1) The rate at which sapling are generating around my house and growing into trees is such that without consistent lumber-jacking they would overrun the place within the course of a year or two

2) Because it's so much more realistic and immersive. In reality it is the swampy areas that are over-grown and dense while dry areas that are at higher risk of fire tend to have sparse vegetation because it is routinely cleared via flre

3) That will delay the problem but not fix it. Better to have a balanced counter-mechanic than to slow down an unbalanced one imo.

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I actually think this would be an interesting and fun idea. It'd add another layer of intrigue to the game and add another risk that's possible. I like the idea. 

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I like the idea, but thinking in a player sense, large fires can create a pretty large burst of lag as it spreads. If that's maintained, I'm fully behind this.

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I like this, but there needs to be a way for the player to put prevention measures in place. Also, I hope that the trees will break if a couple of logs are burnt, because floating trees are the worst way to ruin a landscape. Other than that, I think this could be an interesting 'natural disaster' mechanic that isn't too involved like earthquakes or tornadoes and is still preventable, so it isn't too overpowered

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I have tested a fire mod that my buddy made and we have plans to try to implement it into a server...this is merely a plan at this point. I truly would sell my soul to "Ol Nick" for an accurate depiction of fire in TFC.

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There's a key point that I think Maga might be missing, and that's that saplings do already have checks in place to make sure that forests aren't completely overgrown.

  • Saplings will only generate on grass blocks that have direct line-of-sight to the sky (No leaves above them), a light level of I believe at least 9, and the area must have a temperature of at least 20.
  • Saplings will only grow up into trees if they have enough space to do so in 79. Leaves from other trees block this space, so mechanics like the wall-o-douglas fir tree are a thing of the past.

We might have different ideas of what exactly is considered "overgrown," but for the most part these two checks will make it so that regenerated forests will stop "thickening" once the area is covered in trees that are generally spaced a few blocks apart.

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Maga was not missing either. I had known your first point for several months. I learned about the second unintended "feature/bug" while perusing the forums this morning.

 

We do indeed have different ideas of what overgrown is. I think logically that if there are so many trees in a forest that saplings on the ground don't get enough light/space to grow and mature then the forest is already overgrown. This opinion is also the one held by conservationist and foresters. I have done tree-thinning in the past.

 

Scenario might play out like this:

-No rain for a long time

-Storm comes along

-Lightning strike sets fire that spreads extremely rapidly within the area designated as extremely dry

-A few hours of rain eventually raises the wetness in the area to a point where the fire dies out

-Nature moves in and saplings repopulate the area

 

I'm not suggesting that forest fires should become a regular occurrence, but that the extra level of depth in environmental self-regulation would be a welcome addition to the game.

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I like this, but there needs to be a way for the player to put prevention measures in place. Also, I hope that the trees will break if a couple of logs are burnt, because floating trees are the worst way to ruin a landscape. Other than that, I think this could be an interesting 'natural disaster' mechanic that isn't too involved like earthquakes or tornadoes and is still preventable, so it isn't too overpowered

 

This would be done the same way as in real life. If you want to protect your home and farmland from fire you take the time to cut down trees and create a ring around your home where the fire cannot spread from one side to another. Building in strategic areas with more water or stone around you to protect you is also a logical approach. This scenario made me think of a new bucket mechanic that I will add to the OP. Essentially throwing wooden pails of water would remove flames from a small area.

 

In the grand scheme of things nature doesn't tend to give a crap what people want, and goes around burning stuff anyway... just look at British Columbia after a dry spell.

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Maga was not missing either. I had known your first point for several months. I learned about the second unintended "feature/bug" while perusing the forums this morning.

 

We do indeed have different ideas of what overgrown is. I think logically that if there are so many trees in a forest that saplings on the ground don't get enough light/space to grow and mature then the forest is already overgrown. This opinion is also the one held by conservationist and foresters. I have done tree-thinning in the past.

 

Scenario might play out like this:

-No rain for a long time

-Storm comes along

-Lightning strike sets fire that spreads extremely rapidly within the area designated as extremely dry

-A few hours of rain eventually raises the wetness in the area to a point where the fire dies out

-Nature moves in and saplings repopulate the area

 

I'm not suggesting that forest fires should become a regular occurrence, but that the extra level of depth in environmental self-regulation would be a welcome addition to the game.

 

This is very much like the idea my friend and I have discussed...it would be wonderful. One problem...trees grow idiotically fast....this should be greatly nerfed. Our server had trees taking (species dependent) from 3 to 10 weeks REAL TIME to mature.....loved it and we never came even close to running out of wood...but hey...its a procedurally generated world so just range farther afield. Thanks again for your excellent suggestion.

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