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Maga

Better Forest Fires

11 posts in this topic

Just a quick idea.

 

I'm not sure if this is buried in the code somewhere already but if it's not I think it would make a really cool addition.

 

Now that in 79 random grass block ticking actually creates saplings like it's supposed to, it's very easy for a forest to become overgrown over the course of several years. Nature takes care of this by allowing the increased risk of fire in dense old growth to clear away the old and make way for the new. I was wondering if it would be feasible to make fire spread affected by the general "wetness" of an area. Back in the good old days when fire spread forever in early mine craft beta you were terrified of this natural disaster. Now it's no big deal. Imagine, no rain in an area?... live in fear of ravaging infernoes sweeping the landscape. If you've just been throw a few days/weeks of rain fire spread would be nerfed in that area so that there is no cause for concern and the fire only makes it a few blocks. Dry trees and grass burn much easier than wet ones.  Is this possible?

 

I just figured that since the forest can now regenerate itself there should be a way for it to naturally clear up a little too.

 

 

EDIT:

 

Idea for new bucket mechanic: Using a wooden bucket (because metal ones place source blocks) right clicking a full water bucket would remove fire blocks in a 3x3 or 5x5 area centered on the block you right clicked.

 

If there is no block then shift+right clicking the full bucket in mid-air will have the same effect, but centered on the player, or perhaps one or two blocks ahead of them.

 

This is simply a way for players to not be completely helpless against the inferno, and I think it fits with the style of TFC.

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1.) Is this suggestion based off of speculation, or are you actually observing overgrown forests taking over?

 

2.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, why would a solution based off humidity be a good thing? Wouldn't the problem continue to exist in wet areas, while making it difficuult for trees to survive in areas where there would already be less trees and not have the overpopulation problem?

 

3.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, wouldn't changing the time of growth or sapling failure chances be better options?

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1.) Is this suggestion based off of speculation, or are you actually observing overgrown forests taking over?

 

2.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, why would a solution based off humidity be a good thing? Wouldn't the problem continue to exist in wet areas, while making it difficuult for trees to survive in areas where there would already be less trees and not have the overpopulation problem?

 

3.) If forest overpopulation is a problem, wouldn't changing the time of growth or sapling failure chances be better options?

 

1) The rate at which sapling are generating around my house and growing into trees is such that without consistent lumber-jacking they would overrun the place within the course of a year or two

2) Because it's so much more realistic and immersive. In reality it is the swampy areas that are over-grown and dense while dry areas that are at higher risk of fire tend to have sparse vegetation because it is routinely cleared via flre

3) That will delay the problem but not fix it. Better to have a balanced counter-mechanic than to slow down an unbalanced one imo.

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I actually think this would be an interesting and fun idea. It'd add another layer of intrigue to the game and add another risk that's possible. I like the idea. 

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I like the idea, but thinking in a player sense, large fires can create a pretty large burst of lag as it spreads. If that's maintained, I'm fully behind this.

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I like this, but there needs to be a way for the player to put prevention measures in place. Also, I hope that the trees will break if a couple of logs are burnt, because floating trees are the worst way to ruin a landscape. Other than that, I think this could be an interesting 'natural disaster' mechanic that isn't too involved like earthquakes or tornadoes and is still preventable, so it isn't too overpowered

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I have tested a fire mod that my buddy made and we have plans to try to implement it into a server...this is merely a plan at this point. I truly would sell my soul to "Ol Nick" for an accurate depiction of fire in TFC.

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There's a key point that I think Maga might be missing, and that's that saplings do already have checks in place to make sure that forests aren't completely overgrown.

  • Saplings will only generate on grass blocks that have direct line-of-sight to the sky (No leaves above them), a light level of I believe at least 9, and the area must have a temperature of at least 20.
  • Saplings will only grow up into trees if they have enough space to do so in 79. Leaves from other trees block this space, so mechanics like the wall-o-douglas fir tree are a thing of the past.

We might have different ideas of what exactly is considered "overgrown," but for the most part these two checks will make it so that regenerated forests will stop "thickening" once the area is covered in trees that are generally spaced a few blocks apart.

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Maga was not missing either. I had known your first point for several months. I learned about the second unintended "feature/bug" while perusing the forums this morning.

 

We do indeed have different ideas of what overgrown is. I think logically that if there are so many trees in a forest that saplings on the ground don't get enough light/space to grow and mature then the forest is already overgrown. This opinion is also the one held by conservationist and foresters. I have done tree-thinning in the past.

 

Scenario might play out like this:

-No rain for a long time

-Storm comes along

-Lightning strike sets fire that spreads extremely rapidly within the area designated as extremely dry

-A few hours of rain eventually raises the wetness in the area to a point where the fire dies out

-Nature moves in and saplings repopulate the area

 

I'm not suggesting that forest fires should become a regular occurrence, but that the extra level of depth in environmental self-regulation would be a welcome addition to the game.

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I like this, but there needs to be a way for the player to put prevention measures in place. Also, I hope that the trees will break if a couple of logs are burnt, because floating trees are the worst way to ruin a landscape. Other than that, I think this could be an interesting 'natural disaster' mechanic that isn't too involved like earthquakes or tornadoes and is still preventable, so it isn't too overpowered

 

This would be done the same way as in real life. If you want to protect your home and farmland from fire you take the time to cut down trees and create a ring around your home where the fire cannot spread from one side to another. Building in strategic areas with more water or stone around you to protect you is also a logical approach. This scenario made me think of a new bucket mechanic that I will add to the OP. Essentially throwing wooden pails of water would remove flames from a small area.

 

In the grand scheme of things nature doesn't tend to give a crap what people want, and goes around burning stuff anyway... just look at British Columbia after a dry spell.

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Maga was not missing either. I had known your first point for several months. I learned about the second unintended "feature/bug" while perusing the forums this morning.

 

We do indeed have different ideas of what overgrown is. I think logically that if there are so many trees in a forest that saplings on the ground don't get enough light/space to grow and mature then the forest is already overgrown. This opinion is also the one held by conservationist and foresters. I have done tree-thinning in the past.

 

Scenario might play out like this:

-No rain for a long time

-Storm comes along

-Lightning strike sets fire that spreads extremely rapidly within the area designated as extremely dry

-A few hours of rain eventually raises the wetness in the area to a point where the fire dies out

-Nature moves in and saplings repopulate the area

 

I'm not suggesting that forest fires should become a regular occurrence, but that the extra level of depth in environmental self-regulation would be a welcome addition to the game.

 

This is very much like the idea my friend and I have discussed...it would be wonderful. One problem...trees grow idiotically fast....this should be greatly nerfed. Our server had trees taking (species dependent) from 3 to 10 weeks REAL TIME to mature.....loved it and we never came even close to running out of wood...but hey...its a procedurally generated world so just range farther afield. Thanks again for your excellent suggestion.

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