Drinking water

[Hubertus 29]

Body temperature mechanics will discourage people from living in extermely cold areas such as the coldest areas of Canada/Russia/Norway etc. Its unlikely anyone but the most masochistic players will try living in the TFC equivalents of those climates

 

And Hubertus, you can't claim poll results for a poll that was never created

It's called inference. Also, looking at the poll results thus far, I'm claiming point on this one. All answers think the mechanic shouldn't be changed as of this post (5,4,0) discounting the one answer that supports players having roots.

[Sahji 6]

 

"My argument has nothing to do with how clean the water is."

I know it didn't, so this comment has no bearing on my argument either.

 

"Drinking from a jug as opposed to your hands/submerged isn't going to make the water cleaner. Comparing believable with realistic makes no sense in this case. I am not the one who chose the word "believable", that would be the admin. So saying it's not realistic means nothing when I have purposely used believable, when that is what the game aspires to do. "

 

You did choose to argue believability. Here, I'll post it:

 

"You say that the goal is believability, but being almost unable to drink without a clay container is neither believable, engaging, or an incentive to start making clay items."

 

My counter-point to that was: "your argument that it's not believable is well.... counter-intuitive" because, now follow me here, saying that a process isn't believable invites a more realistic solution. What follows naturally from "drinking without a jug is unbelievable" is a more believable use of jugs, which would be water purifying. So, in sum, I was trying to communicate that: arguing that it's not believable is not the best approach to this discussion.

 

As an incentive, it's worthless. I'm not going to look for clay to drink faster, I'm doing it to get started on tools. And if I start in a region with no clay, then fuck my life, I have to waste time as I look for clay. Defining incentive isn't going to make this fit into that.

Sure! That's great! I wasn't arguing that it was a good incentive, only that clay jugs are aimed as an incentive of environmental pressures.

 

"Also, if you don't know that the jug makes you drink faster, then you won't find out until you need it for it's actual purpose. You won't Google "how to drink faster in terrafirmacraft". The only way to find out is to do it by accident."

Agreed on that, the design isn't what I'd call intuitive.

 

"To sum up, it's a waste of time, it's not an incentive to do anything that there isn't much stronger incentives for already, it's a waste of space, even if you carry around a jug, as it still takes away at least one space that you could otherwise use, being unrealistic (which this also isn't as it's purely a matter of speed) have no baring on how believable it is, and because there is no way of knowing that this is how it is, it's a hindrance for new players.

 

That's not an incentive, or a believable representation, it's a flawed design."

 

So my post wasn't "anything new, relevent"? It was both new and relevent in that never earlier in any of your posts thus far had you ever discussed its value as a incentive, for or against. This is something that must be addressed to fully argue that your idea is better. Attacking me for bringing it up doesn't help in any way.

 

Ultimately Castiel, my post was to urge you to explain in full while taking into consideration what the process was originally intended for. If you managed to debate it well enough, it would perhaps be changed, which I personally have no problem with.

[kev12east 21]

Why not increase the amount of time it takes for water to deplete (say, 3-7 days IGT) and make reaching 0% water actually kill the player, yet leave everything else the same. This way those who somehow manage to dehydrate multiple times a day won't have to drink as often, thus leaving the slow drinking to not be a huge problem.

[Hubertus 29]

You're already dead after 3 days of no water. Even after a day of water you're greatly weakened.

 

One thing I don't understand is how anybody finds the current drinking rate an issue. Seriously, getting a water jug is one of the very first things you do, just after getting basic tools. How is anybody drinking enough water by hand to feel the need to change the mechanic?

[Castiel 0]

never earlier in any of your posts thus far had you ever discussed its value as a incentive, for or against.

 

It was literally the post before yours, where I talked about nothing but how bad it is as an incentive...

[kev12east 21]

You're already dead after 3 days of no water. Even after a day of water you're greatly weakened.

 

One thing I don't understand is how anybody finds the current drinking rate an issue. Seriously, getting a water jug is one of the very first things you do, just after getting basic tools. How is anybody drinking enough water by hand to feel the need to change the mechanic?

 

Longest record for going without water is ten days.

 

TBH, I love the current system. It is very relaxed and peaceful, which is how I play TFC, instead of the OMG I must have everything NOW! that some people do

[Thrainn 2]

Longest record for going without water is ten days.TBH, I love the current system. It is very relaxed and peaceful, which is how I play TFC, instead of the OMG I must have everything NOW! that some people do

Yeah, well, I would very much like to play relaxed amd peaceful too, but how, when the days in minecraft are so ridiculously short?!

[lipki 40]

I drowned ... I still thirst.

[Castiel 0]

You're already dead after 3 days of no water. Even after a day of water you're greatly weakened.

 

One thing I don't understand is how anybody finds the current drinking rate an issue. Seriously, getting a water jug is one of the very first things you do, just after getting basic tools. How is anybody drinking enough water by hand to feel the need to change the mechanic?

That would be anyone who didn't read what ever change log says that's the faster way of doing it. The wiki doesn't even say it's faster, it says it replenishes 3 bars, but not how fast.

 

So unless you make one and try it out, which often isn't needed, you will never find out.

[Kittychanley 1,002]

That would be anyone who didn't read what ever change log says that's the faster way of doing it. The wiki doesn't even say it's faster, it says it replenishes 3 bars, but not how fast.

 

So unless you make one and try it out, which often isn't needed, you will never find out.

 

Seriously? The wiki says it replenishes 3 bars. You use your hand once, and see that your hand replenishes half a bar. Obviously 3 bars is faster than half a bar.

[Bunsan 323]

The amount of time and energy spent on this issue is confusing for me. My first kilns always include 2 jugs. I always bring 2 with me anywhere in case one breaks. It is one of the simplest things to do early on. The fact that the mechanic is sped up is just a bonus for the unlikely event I find myself with 2 broken jugs.

[Castiel 0]

The amount of time and energy spent on this issue is confusing for me. My first kilns always include 2 jugs. I always bring 2 with me anywhere in case one breaks. It is one of the simplest things to do early on. The fact that the mechanic is sped up is just a bonus for the unlikely event I find myself with 2 broken jugs.

The reason i'm bringing this up is that I didn't know once I started playing. I had played terrafirmacraft years ago when there was no water bar, and upon returning, I had no way of knowing that there was a faster way, and I don't think it's obvious enough from the wiki. I also don't see why it should be as slow as it is, considering the speed with which you eat. I agree that drinking from a jug should be faster, but the difference should not be this ridiculously overdone.

[Kittychanley 1,002]

The reason i'm bringing this up is that I didn't know once I started playing. I had played terrafirmacraft years ago when there was no water bar, and upon returning, I had no way of knowing that there was a faster way, and I don't think it's obvious enough from the wiki. I also don't see why it should be as slow as it is, considering the speed with which you eat. I agree that drinking from a jug should be faster, but the difference should not be this ridiculously overdone.

 

I'm guessing that you started playing TFC again after the drinking mechanic was changed? The old mechanic that was around for quite some time that just required having your feet in the water was even slower than the current one.

[ScribJellyDonut 1]

I'm of the opinion that right clicking to drink is much too slow at the moment. I see the jug as a method of drinking water when fresh sources aren't available like in deserts or oceans. It can also simply be a quicker way to quench thirst.

What makes the thirst mechanic fun is monitoring it and planning around it, especially for long exploratory trips; Not tediously standing in water holding down the mouse button for 2 minutes. Not only can I quench my thirst faster in real life by cupping my hands, but in TerraFirmaCraft timescales this equates to sitting in place and drinking water for a couple of hours - which is just silly.

I like the incentive to make jugs, and hopefully later on more durable metal or glass drinking vessels, but there is no reason drinking with the hand should take so long unless you're just a masochist. I think that as a starting point it should be about 3 to 5 times faster than it currently is, and maybe tweak it from there.

[Castiel 0]

I'm guessing that you started playing TFC again after the drinking mechanic was changed? The old mechanic that was around for quite some time that just required having your feet in the water was even slower than the current one.

In case it wasn't clear from my previous post, I last played before there were any drinking mechanic at all (as far as I remember), and i started playing again after the current mechanic was implemented.

 

 

I'm of the opinion that right clicking to drink is much too slow at the moment. I see the jug as a method of drinking water when fresh sources aren't available like in deserts or oceans. It can also simply be a quicker way to quench thirst.What makes the thirst mechanic fun is monitoring it and planning around it, especially for long exploratory trips; Not tediously standing in water holding down the mouse button for 2 minutes. Not only can I quench my thirst faster in real life by cupping my hands, but in TerraFirmaCraft timescales this equates to sitting in place and drinking water for a couple of hours - which is just silly.I like the incentive to make jugs, and hopefully later on more durable metal or glass drinking vessels, but there is no reason drinking with the hand should take so long unless you're just a masochist. I think that as a starting point it should be about 3 to 5 times faster than it currently is, and maybe tweak it from there.

 

My point exactly.

[Hubertus 29]

That would be anyone who didn't read what ever change log says that's the faster way of doing it. The wiki doesn't even say it's faster, it says it replenishes 3 bars, but not how fast.

 

So unless you make one and try it out, which often isn't needed, you will never find out.

This argument is so invalid, it got murdered in its bed because it wouldn't run to the balcony and scream for help. You didn't know there was a better way of doing something, so the developers should make the best way to do something the way you initially thought it was done? I'm sorry, but how do you know how to do ANYTHING other than reading the wiki/forums or watching let's plays? How did you ever figure out how to build an axe so that you could stop punching trees in vanilla? By your line of reasoning, punching a tree should have been just as efficient as using an axe, because "unless you made one and tried it out, which often isn't needed, you would never find out". I hope you can see how laughable that line of thinking is.

[Castiel 0]

This argument is so invalid, it got murdered in its bed because it wouldn't run to the balcony and scream for help. You didn't know there was a better way of doing something, so the developers should make the best way to do something the way you initially thought it was done? I'm sorry, but how do you know how to do ANYTHING other than reading the wiki/forums or watching let's plays?

I don't watch let's plays, I prefer playing a game myself more than watching what other do and then copy them; Nor do I read an entire wiki, which you would need to find the one sentence on the wiki that says anything about drinking faster, including the no-nonsense-stoneage-guide and the thirst bar. My argument still stands, unless you are told by someone (let's plays), read through the wiki in detail, (which doesn't sounds very appealing to me, I prefer playing games rather than reading about them), read the change log, or use the jug for it's actual purpose, which is portable water storage, you would not know.

 

Regardless, running around with more things in your inventory for a reason that I have yet to hear is hardly a "better way of doing something".

 

How did you ever figure out how to build an axe so that you could stop punching trees in vanilla? By your line of reasoning, punching a tree should have been just as efficient as using an axe, because "unless you made one and tried it out, which often isn't needed, you would never find out". I hope you can see how laughable that line of thinking is.

Except you can actually look up "how to build an axe". Even if you were to look up "how to drink faster", you would get nowhere. Honestly, so far your attempt at an argument is so laughably immature and thoughtlessly executed, you should probably give it a bit more thought when you post.

Also, so far it's less than half that want's the current mechanic to stay.

[Hubertus 29]

Well, then it's a good thing that if you searched "drinking", or read the wiki page about the thirst bar, it'll clearly tell you to use a ceramic jug. Found that in like 10 seconds. Heck, even the unofficial TFC wiki has that nugget of information clearly displayed.

Also, a quick search of "how to drink terrafirmacraft" on google gives plenty of results.

As an aside, the issues you're pointing out now aren't issues with the mod. You're complaining about inadequate documentation. Since minecraft has no tutorial, it is your duty to find the information you require. Any negative effect that has on your gameplay is not really the fault of the developers. You could argue that the game should be more intuitive, but since when has minecraft ever been intuitive. So, either do a quick search, ask somebody, or keep spending minutes drinking water.

Also, the most people are fine with the current mechanic. The vast majority don't think you should get the same amount of water from drinking by hand. When you consider the fact that this is a match between the status quo and making things easier, and the status quo is actually WINNING, that's pretty overwhelming support. People tend to vote for things that make life easier for them (within reason). Increasing the water gained from hand drinking is a pretty minor change. And yet, people are voting for the status quo.

Now, since everything has pretty much been said up to this point, and the thread has degraded to petty insults, I think we're done, here.

[Kittychanley 1,002]

I am currently looking into decreasing the volume of the slurping sound at a bare minimum, because good God does that get annoying quickly. I may tweak the amount of water you get at the same time, but even if I do so it won't be much of a change, and it will still be significantly faster to use a jug.

[ScribJellyDonut 1]

It's not as if making the hand faster would obsolete the jug. Even if drinking by hand were as fast as the jug, and I'm not implying that it should be, jugs would still be a very useful thing to have - especially when your exploration plans don't involve searching for freshwater sources every five minutes.

[Saberwulfy 12]

Jug is to store and carry water and not to be a cup, i think pointless need a jug to be fast if you are in the river.

this is a wrong use of the function

[Castiel 0]

Well, then it's a good thing that if you searched "drinking", or read the wiki page about the thirst bar, it'll clearly tell you to use a ceramic jug. Found that in like 10 seconds. Heck, even the unofficial TFC wiki has that nugget of information clearly displayed.

Also, a quick search of "how to drink terrafirmacraft" on google gives plenty of results.

As an aside, the issues you're pointing out now aren't issues with the mod. You're complaining about inadequate documentation. Since minecraft has no tutorial, it is your duty to find the information you require. Any negative effect that has on your gameplay is not really the fault of the developers. You could argue that the game should be more intuitive, but since when has minecraft ever been intuitive. So, either do a quick search, ask somebody, or keep spending minutes drinking water.

Also, the most people are fine with the current mechanic. The vast majority don't think you should get the same amount of water from drinking by hand. When you consider the fact that this is a match between the status quo and making things easier, and the status quo is actually WINNING, that's pretty overwhelming support. People tend to vote for things that make life easier for them (within reason). Increasing the water gained from hand drinking is a pretty minor change. And yet, people are voting for the status quo.

Now, since everything has pretty much been said up to this point, and the thread has degraded to petty insults, I think we're done, here.

The wiki entry on the thirst bar only says you can drink from jugs, what good does that do?. My problem isn't that there is no a water container, but apparently you are incapable of reading.

 

A quick search gave four links before starting videos, only one of which mentioned that it's faster, from an independent wiki.

I personally think it says a lot that you would have to search two beginners guides to be told that there is a faster way of doing something, but I guess you read through the internet before you have the guts to try moving the mouse in-game.

 

I am not complaining about inadequate documentation, people just haven't given me any reasons why it shouldn't be changed, instead they keep saying "just read the wiki", which I then respond to.

 

I never said you should get the same amount (again, not good at reading are you?), I am saying that the current speed is ludicrously slow, for absolutely no reason at all. And seeing as less than half are voting for it to stay the same, I would love to see your definition of "vast majority", "overwhelming", "winning", and "most", seeing as you are obviously either making them up as you go, or simply don't know what they mean.

 

If you don't want petty insults, then I suggest you don't start of with one.

[Kittychanley 1,002]

This thread has dissolved into insults, and has been locked.