Content: Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Background: Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Pattern: Blank Waves Notes Sharp Wood Rockface Leather Honey Vertical Triangles
Welcome to TerraFirmaCraft Forums

Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to contribute to this site by submitting your own content or replying to existing content. You'll be able to customize your profile, receive reputation points as a reward for submitting content, while also communicating with other members via your own private inbox, plus much more! This message will be removed once you have signed in.

  • Announcements

    • Dries007

      ATTENTION Forum Database Breach   03/04/2019

      There has been a breach of our database. Please make sure you change your password (use a password manager, like Lastpass).
      If you used this password anywhere else, change that too! The passwords themselves are stored hashed, but may old accounts still had old, insecure (by today's standards) hashes from back when they where created. This means they can be "cracked" more easily. Other leaked information includes: email, IP, account name.
      I'm trying my best to find out more and keep everyone up to date. Discord (http://invite.gg/TerraFirmaCraft) is the best option for up to date news and questions. I'm sorry for this, but the damage has been done. All I can do is try to make sure it doesn't happen again.
    • Claycorp

      This forum is now READ ONLY!   01/20/2020

      As of this post and forever into the future this forum has been put into READ ONLY MODE. There will be no new posts! A replacement is coming SoonTM . If you wish to stay up-to-date on whats going on or post your content. Please use the Discord or Sub-Reddit until the new forums are running.

      Any questions or comments can be directed to Claycorp on either platform.
DrCataclysm

[Answered] Questions about (Sequoia) Sapling Spawning

11 posts in this topic

I've cleared out a fairly large area in a distant sequoia forest in an attempt to generate saplings (to bring back to my home and plant for aesthetics)

 

But I've yet to see a sequoia sapling spawn, but the other sapling types of that forest have appeared.

 

My questions are:

 

  • Do sequoia saplings spawn/generate more rarely than other saplings? Should I just be patient and keep the chunks loaded during the spring-summer months?
  • Does sapling spawning depend on whether or not the tree in question (Sequoia, in this case) is a primary tree or secondary tree?
  • Will removing more sequoia trees encourage sapling generation?

For clarification, Sequoia saplings do not drop from leaves (and that is not what these questions are about), but still regenerate in natural Sequoia Forests. Acacia and Kapok saplings are only available by cheating them in.

 

EDIT: Kittychanley posted an excellent explanation below!

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You can get sequoia saplings only through creative mode

 

Edit: As stated in the FAQ:

 

Why aren't Sequoia, Kapok or Acacia trees dropping saplings?
It is a design decision to make getting kapok/acacia saplings impossible, and for sequoia trees to not drop saplings. This is partially a balance issue (I know I could let you have small trees if I wanted), but it also has two other reasons behind it.

  • [*]
It introduces a concept to lumber that is lacking, scarcity. You might have all the wood you could need for a while if you start in a jungle biome but you'll find out sooner or later that it all goes away and you'll never again have purple planks unless you find another jungle. [*]It also raises awareness to the very real problem that we face on earth of our jungles being wiped out by systematic logging. (I'm no tree-hugger, but this sad).

Edit: derped

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

You can get sequoia saplings only through creative mode

Sorry, you are incorrect.

 

http://wiki.terrafirmacraft.com/Sapling

 

 

Note: Sequoia saplings do not drop from leaves, but still regenerate in natural Sequoia Forests. Acacia and Kapok saplings are only available by cheating them in.

 

I have seen a sequoia sapling generate before (but not in the particular forest I'm currently in). Other players on this server have also acquired Sequoia saplings through this method

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's actually new to me. o.O

sry for the derp

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I've seen in my playtroughs, practically only the primary tree type saplings spawn in an given forest. Other saplings spawn extremely rarely or even not at all, I am not sure. It is only based on my experience tough so clarification from Devs would be appriciated.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's actually new to me. o.O

sry for the derp

 

But woo, you learned something new and shiny!

 

I'm here to also verify I've seen Sequoia saplings spawn in a Sequoia forest but it is a very low chance.  I think within the 2 in-game years I saw 2 trees spawn.  (This was in an old build but I'm pretty sure the spawn rate is the same.)  Also, I recall they act like vanilla Jungle tress so you need 4 saplings per tree but they do spawn with 4 saplings. Least I'm pretty sure they do as it was a while ago.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Do sequoia saplings spawn/generate more rarely than other saplings? Should I just be patient and keep the chunks loaded during the spring-summer months?
  • Does sapling spawning depend on whether or not the tree in question (Sequoia, in this case) is a primary tree or secondary tree?
  • Will removing more sequoia trees encourage sapling generation?

 

Before answering all of these directly, I'll try to explain who the mechanic works as a whole. Let me know if I missed anything and if you still have questions.

 

Sapling spawning is handled primarily within the code of grass blocks, and therefore only occurs when a grass block has received a random tick (similar to what triggers grass spreading). When the block triggers, it first checks if it able to directly see the sky. If it cannot see the sky (even if it is blocked by just leaves), nothing will happen. The grass block then checks that it is regular grass, and not dry grass, that it is not underwater, and that there is an air block above it. Finally it checks to make sure that the temperature is higher than 20, and it runs a random number generator, with a 1 in 15,000 chance of spawning a sapling. If the RNG is successful, it calls a specific method to determine what kind of sapling to spawn. This method first checks if the sapling will have space to grow. It scans 8 blocks in each direction (NSEW) and 6 blocks up. If within this scan a trunk of a tree or another sapling is found, it exits and no sapling is generated. If there is space, it runs another RNG to pick which tree type it should spawn. For the three different tree types, the chances are 40/30/30, so the primary tree has a very slight preference than the other two. The sapling will also only spawn if the climate is correct for that type of tree to generate there, meaning that if you've never seen that tree in the area on world generation, then that sapling will not spawn.

 

So to answer your questions:

  • All saplings are weighted equally, sequoia is no more likely to spawn than willow as a whole. Either sequoia is one of the tree layers and was found there naturally on world generation and the sapling will spawn, or it wasn't, and it won't. Keeping the chunks loaded is indeed necessary as it requires the grass blocks to receive random ticks. Rather than focusing specifically on spring-summer months, keep an eye on the temperature. If it's 20 or lower, don't bother hanging around because the saplings will not spawn.
  • The primary/secondary tree will have a slight effect on which sapling spawns, but not much, and they will both spawn.
  • Yes. The grass block requires direct line of sight to the sky (which could be blocked by sequoia leaves) and it cannot be within 8 blocks of a sequoia trunk.

 

Also, I recall they act like vanilla Jungle tress so you need 4 saplings per tree but they do spawn with 4 saplings. Least I'm pretty sure they do as it was a while ago.

 

This is incorrect, none of the trees in TFC require a 2x2, just one sapling is enough.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"Many words"

 

Oh, now I've learned something new and shiny, awesome.

 

Yeah, I really wasn't 100% sure on the 2x2 since it was so many worlds ago, thus the "pretty sure." Thanks for the clear up. :)  Good to know it applies to all saplings too.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After reading all the posts and wiki, I am still unsuccessful in farming sequoia saplings in a region where only sequoia grows and rain/temp/evt are ok for sequoia.

This prevents me from secretly planting the whole server with the beautiful sequoias.

Disconsolate, I went to see the code to understand the mechanics better.

 

So the grass block tick update makes it possible to sapling to appear only when temp is >20, but sequoia valid temp is 10 - 16.

 

Therefore if the sequoia is the only tree which can grow in the area, saplings will never appear, because at least one type of trees must be within the parameters, correct?

 

And even if there are other tree types which can grow in the area, sequoia will not appear anyway, because temperature is still finally checked.

 

Therefore sequoia saplings can never spawn. Please, please tell me I am wrong :`( I don't know Java, I hope I am mistaken in code analysis. Could you please hint the lines where the sequoia saplings leak to life?

 

Despite I personally found 4 sequoia saplings in the wild, I guess it can be explained this way: during the initial world generation the WorldGenSaplings.generate is somehow called without the "temp > 20" check, so lots of saplings appear.  And few saplings in the forest do not grow by some reasons, so are left for people.

 

Sorry for any inconvenience, my brain is broken by java and despair :)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fact that you have sequoia saplings is proof that it is indeed working as intended, because other than cheating them in there is literally no other way to get them other than them spawning on top of the grass blocks. There is not a single other place in the TFC code that calls WorldGenSaplings. I can take a look later, but if I had to guess the misunderstanding likely came from the fact that you didn't realize there are two separate temperature values that are used in the code for calculations. The current temp, shown by temp on the F3 screen is what we use in the grass block code. The avgbiotemp which is an average temperature of the area over a long period of time is generally what is used in calculations that are specific to the climate of an area as a whole. It is 100% possible for the current temp to be over 20, while the avgbiotemp is between 10 and 16. The reason that we use the two different values is so that you can explore the world during the hottest day in the middle of summer, and the coldest day in the dead of winter, and generally still find the same animals and the same trees and everything else. If we didn't, then the whole world would be a jungle if you explored during the summer, or the tundra if you explored during the winter.

 

Grass code using the current temp:

 

https://github.com/Deadrik/TFCraft/blob/19d5ab9cc8ca451a14d58bb9511aa936716c6d69/src/Common/com/bioxx/tfc/Blocks/Terrain/BlockGrass.java#L214

 

Sapling Gen code using the average bio temp:

 

https://github.com/Deadrik/TFCraft/blob/19d5ab9cc8ca451a14d58bb9511aa936716c6d69/src/Common/com/bioxx/tfc/WorldGen/Generators/WorldGenSaplings.java#L40

Edited by Kittychanley
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awwwwwww! Yes! Thousand times sorry! I got confused with all the temperature functions and missed this fact! Awwwwwww!

 

Thank you, kind Kittychanley, for resurrecting my hope! I seem to have the perfect biome for the farm, just need to be there at the correct season.

Formerly I was incorrectly preferring 10 - 16 range of current temp, "hoping" there is an exception in "> 20" rule.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites