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    • Crysyn

      Only help if you can be helpful

      Hey All, A topic has come up of late in the IRC channel in regards to the general feel of the forums and the community that supports them. Things have progressed further than I would have liked with out this being addressed more publicly because I would much rather have snubbed this out sooner rather than later.. but I have been busy. Here is the general rule I would like people to follow: Wheaton's Law "Don't be a dick." Those of you from the IRC channel know that this is the only rule I ask people in there to follow and we generally have a good and lively time chatting about all manner of things. This is basic rule that just about everyone understands and I am going to expand it to the forums from here moving forward. If you can not help people in a helpful and polite manner then I simply ask you to stop. Now I generally take a back seat to moderating the forums as I like to participate in the suggestions forum fairly heavily at times and would rather do so as a forums user than a moderator. But I am also fairly well known for being the person who constantly puts their foot down and so I am stepping up and doing so on here. If you find yourself unable to respond to a message politely then I ask that you do not respond. This mostly focuses on the increasing level of hostility found within the Suggestion forum as well as the Server forum. I do not care if this is the 30th some odd time you have seen someone make the same suggestion. Or even if the new post on an older topic is one entry above the old one. I expect the members of this forum to respond politely to the user, new or old, and point to the older topic if it applies and even go the extra step to suggest they either add in new information or to summarize the outcome of the previous discussion based upon the new post's entry into it. That is what we are here for, that is why I close most topics instead of deleting them, so that they can be found and referenced down the road. The next topic is the slew of derailment attempts I have seen as of late. If you want to have fun and joke around that is what the off topic forum is for and pretty much anything goes there. I do not expect to read a suggestion thread and have to go through 3 pages of image memes people have shot back and forth. Quite simply this is a waste of my time to read and then have to clean up. Now for the summary. I am going to start taking a more active role, especially in policing the suggestion forum, and handing out warn levels to people whom I see doing this. These will be indiscriminate and applied not to just the first person who derails or is impolite on a topic or response, but to everyone whom follows the lead of that person. As I do not like doing things with out giving you all warning this post shall serve as that warning. If you have a desire to bring this topic up with me then I invite you to do so on the IRC channel. Lets raise the level of quality and grow the community. Let us not descend into the quality often found on the minecraft or league of legend forums. There is simply no need for that here. Be passionate about things, just do not be abusive.
    • Kittychanley

      Offline Servers

      Recently I've seen a few server listings showing up on the first page of the Servers forum that have been closed for an extended period of time, but have recently gotten a reply from a new member who didn't realize the server is offline. To help prevent this from happening in the future, it would be greatly appreciated if you could use the report function on the original post of any servers that have been confirmed as offline, so that the topic may be locked. If you are the admin of a server and plan on taking the server offline, please use the report function on the original post of your topic to let the TFC Staff know that the topic should be locked. If you are the admin of a server that has a locked topic, and would wish to bring the server back online, please use the report function on the original post of the topic to let the TFC Staff know that the topic should be unlocked. As always, please remember to follow rule #3 of the servers forum and update your topic title to contain the version of TFC that the server is currently running. You can do so by editing the OP, and then clicking on "Use Full Editor."
tetrified

[TFC 0.79.17] Anvil Calculator

22 posts in this topic

Find yourself struggling to craft your gear before your ingots cool down? Do you just hit the buttons until it works? Do you find it tedious to figure out how to smith your tools? Well I have a solution for you!

 

The TerraFirmaCraft Anvil Solver!

 

Just type in your material ID, the ID of the item you want to make, and select the last three steps(first, second, last), and this nifty application will tell you what you need to do to create the weapons, armour, or tools of your dreams!

post-17847-0-65975800-1428358899_thumb.j

 

The file is hosted here.

Leave the seed as 0 to use in version 79.15-79.17.

To get your seed, you can either type /seed, or recreate your world and look at the seed there (I like that one more because it lets you copy paste your seed) I personally recommend keeping your seed in a text document somewhere to copy and paste it easily whenever you're smithing.

 

If you have suggestions on things I should do to improve this project, or features I can add, I'm all ears.

Edited by tetrified
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This will not work. The location of the arrow is dependent on the world seed, so the list of actions required to complete a tool changes for every world.

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This will not work. The location of the arrow is dependent on the world seed, so the list of actions required to complete a tool changes for every world.

 

It has worked in three worlds I've tried, two creative, and one survival

 

 

for farther clarification, this only takes in to account the item ID's world seed isn't included at all.

70 + new Random((in != null ? Item.getIdFromItem(in.getItem()) : 0) + (result != null ? Item.getIdFromItem(result.getItem()) : 0)).nextInt(craftingBoundDefault)

random(seed).nextInt(max)

this will always return the same value, as long as seed remains the same, and unless item ID is dependant on world seed (which I highly doubt) the arrow will always be in the same spot.

 

and this determines the last hits of the items, and is clearly static

 

 

and if it is ever changed to be determined by world seed, I can always change my algorithm to account for a world seed that the user would enter.

Edited by tetrified
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The last three hits will always be the same, yes, that's how the minigame works. The hits leading up to that do change for each instance though. Numerical ItemIDs are not static, and if you install mods other than TFC it is extremely likely that the number ID for say a copper ingot will be different from someone who has just TFC installed.

 

World seed not being taken into account is a bug that apparently happened when we ported to Minecraft 1.7.10. It has been fixed for the next version of TFC so it is taken into account.

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Numerical ItemIDs are not static, and if you install mods other than TFC it is extremely likely that the number ID for say a copper ingot will be different from someone who has just TFC installed.

 

This is a problem, but one that can be fixed by labelling this "Vanilla only", the item ID's should remain the same across vanilla installs.

also, wouldn't that make this page entirely useless?

 

World seed not being taken into account is a bug that apparently happened when we ported to Minecraft 1.7.10. It has been fixed for the next version of TFC so it is taken into account.

 

And when this happens, I'll modify my algorithm to match yours, and require a seed input from the user

Edited by tetrified
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http://wiki.terrafirmacraft.com/index.php?title=Item_Index&action=history

 

Last updated October of 2014. See the big warning at the top of every wiki page stating that it's still under construction for the 79 update? One of those changes is switching all of the numerical IDs to the proper string ones.

 

Ooh, string id's? That should make this even easier. And also portable across mod installs, yeah? Awesome, I'll update it when the 79 update comes out.

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You're missing the point. The calculation uses Numerical IDs, not string ones. The numerical IDs are generated completely separate from the string ones, and change from install to install.

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You're missing the point. The calculation uses Numerical IDs, not string ones. The numerical IDs are generated completely separate from the string ones, and change from install to install.

 

Ah I thought the calculation was going to change as well. Oh well. But the numerical id's should remain identical across installs of "vanilla" TFC.

 

And across installs that aren't vanilla they should be offset by a constant, which shouldn't be hard to find out for a specific combination.

Edited by tetrified
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That's not completely guaranteed, as it's possible they may change for people who are just using different versions of forge. The only way that you can possibly guarantee that this addon will work is if you have users input the number IDs of their items.

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Mojang intentionally moved away from numerical IDs and to string ones because of how finicky they are. The number IDs of items can change between different forge versions, or even between different versions of TFC. If TFC ever adds a new item or block to the game, all of the old number IDs will change and your addon will no longer work.

 

We intentionally use these super finicky number IDs for our calculations to prevent players from doing exactly what your addon is doing, which takes the fun out of the minigame and turns it into nothing more than an app that a player uses to progress faster. This is also the reason why the math behind anvil smithing is banned from the guides forum, and not allowed to be posted on the wiki.

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That's not completely guaranteed, as it's possible they may change for people who are just using different versions of forge. The only way that you can possibly guarantee that this addon will work is if you have users input the number IDs of their items.

 

This is actually a great idea, as much as I like the idea of the menu, I like your idea better and have updated to that.

 

 

Mojang intentionally moved away from numerical IDs and to string ones because of how finicky they are. The number IDs of items can change between different forge versions, or even between different versions of TFC. If TFC ever adds a new item or block to the game, all of the old number IDs will change and your addon will no longer work.

 

We intentionally use these super finicky number IDs for our calculations to prevent players from doing exactly what your addon is doing, which takes the fun out of the minigame and turns it into nothing more than an app that a player uses to progress faster. This is also the reason why the math behind anvil smithing is banned from the guides forum, and not allowed to be posted on the wiki.

 

A lot of people (myself included) seem to consider the system really annoying.

Edited by tetrified
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Well i got a solution.... Why dont you just type in the seed and it can find the right plan for it? Just putting in ideas

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Ive made so many tools now that I remember every single hit. I can make a pickaxe with my eyes closed.

And if i change the world, I will be able to start from the red arrow, so that the recepie (for example) for a wrough iron sheet is: Punch; Bend; L.Hit; L.Hit; L.Hit.

Edited by Sugar_Fox
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Just a heads up, this will not be compatible with 0.79.18. We are updating the system to not only use the world seed, but also use a randomly generated seed that is based off of things you cannot easily obtain as a player (Such as the exact time the world was generated down to the millisecond, or the exact amount of time it takes for the world to be generated down to the millisecond,etc ). Note that we will be implementing this in such a way that players do not need to worry about their recipes being reset each time the server/game is rebooted.

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Kitty,

You have made a valiant effort to thwart this exploitive piece of software and I applaud you for that. May I suggest an additional seed source to pull from? Use a seed generated from the theoretical max flop count on the computer running the minecraft virtual machine as well as a precise bit count of active memory at initial render time and then pass it through a 256 bit RSA encryption to spit out the actual seed used to create the secure item id's. It would be a virtually instant calculation at the generation point of the world and would be impossible to duplicate as the system will never be in the same physical state again :)

Try to work around that one tetrified :P

Edited by Balthizarlucien
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Kitty,You have made a valiant effort to thwart this exploitive piece of software and I applaud you for that. May I suggest an additional seed source to pull from? Use a seed generated from the theoretical max flop count on the computer running the minecraft virtual machine as well as a precise bit count of active memory at initial render time and then pass it through a 256 bit RSA encryption to spit out the actual seed used to create the secure item id's. It would be a virtually instant calculation at the generation point of the world and would be impossible to duplicate as the system will never be in the same physical state again :)Try to work around that one tetrified :P

 

 

Well, the easiest way to do it would be to simply write the script as a minecraft mod, pull the goal value, and then display the steps on the user's screen.

 

But that would take longer than half an hour, so I'm not going to bother. I just wanted you to know that this sort of thing is an exercise in futality.

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As long as you provide a way for server admins to stop their players from using it, go right ahead and create a mod that you install on the Minecraft client.

 

We have made it very clear that we do not support this type of addon. If after the 79.18 update you somehow manage to get around all the effort that we put in explicitly to stop addons like this from being created, and you still don't include some sort of way to allow servers to stop players from using it, this addon and you will be permanently banned from this forum.

 

There's this concept you don't seem to quite understand that's called "Respect a Developer's wishes"

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As long as you provide a way for server admins to stop their players from using it, go right ahead and create a mod that you install on the Minecraft client.

 

We have made it very clear that we do not support this type of addon. If after the 79.18 update you somehow manage to get around all the effort that we put in explicitly to stop addons like this from being created, and you still don't include some sort of way to allow servers to stop players from using it, this addon and you will be permanently banned from this forum.

 

There's this concept you don't seem to quite understand that's called "Respect a Developer's wishes"

 

Would the 'superseed' be in the NBT data still? I got bored of TFC and haven't installed it for a while.

 

The way to avoid it when you had 'seed' as part of the formula was simple, though:

disallow the /seed command to non-op players

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Yes, the superseed will be in the NBT data for worldinfo.

 

And no that is not a valid method of "allowing servers to stop players from using it" because all it takes is for one player to use /seed before they switch it to op-only, or for an op to use /seed and share it with other players for other reasons.

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Yes, the superseed will be in the NBT data for worldinfo.

 

And no that is not a valid method of "allowing servers to stop players from using it" because all it takes is for one player to use /seed before they switch it to op-only, or for an op to use /seed and share it with other players for other reasons.

 

 

This update doesn't break my application at all then, it just makes the 'seed' option a little confusing (they would need to type in superseed instead of the seed)

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You are only partially correct. For singleplayer, no it does not break your app. Of course you have to get the superseed out of the game in the first place somehow, which will require a mod or nbt sniffing in a dat file. For SMP, your client never has the superseed sent to them. So unless a server admin retrieves the superseed for you, your app will no longer function. And if I'm wrong, i'll go back and rework it until I am correct. There are of course other ways for you to build your app and we'll never be able to stop certain incarnations, but I don't plan to make it easy for you to adversely affect the experience of others for your own satisfaction.

 

I do not care that this app exists for the purpose of singleplayer. However if a person creates an app or mod which has the effect of altering gameplay for players on a server without the consent of the server owner, it will not be accepted here.

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