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Nekozji

taste profile - nothing is anything?

7 posts in this topic

Have you read, understood, and followed all of the rules listed in large text at the top of the support forum? (Yes/No): yes

TFC Version #: 79.17

Forge Version #: 10.13.2.1291
<snipped rest due to being a general feature question rather than a bug report>

 

 

Hey there,

 

I'm struggling a bit with tastes. I understand that each player has a unique profile, and that different soils modify the taste of foods, but I've not seen any information about which kind of soil has which pH, or what foods in absolute terms tend to be sour/bitter/sweet/etc (I can guess a few of these, assuming TFC follows reality).

 

So far I have found only three non-sandwich-or-salad foods that has any kind of taste listed; gooseberries, snowberries, and pickled onions. All other harvested foods and breads and meats are 'not taste' in all categories. This is making it pretty hard for me to predict the outcome of any particular sandwich. I understand tastes are an additive effect, but sometimes I will get 'ridiculously' tasteful sandwiches, even though all five ingredients were 'not'. Sometimes I'll get a 'perfectly' but I can't identify which ingredients did/did not contribute. I have expert level cooking skill.

 

Just wanted to know if that's how things are meant to be, or whether there's something I need to account for, or whether there's a specific set of conditions that could cause flavourless food? Not sure if the intent is to push players towards a long running experimentation with crop types - I'm fine with it if that's the case :) So far I've tried farming on limestone, and gneiss, but neither have produced any flavoursome veggies or tasty fruits. (And I just realised I have no idea whether fruit trees and bushes need water to be tastier...)

 

Am I just unlucky to have been born into this world with only two tastebuds? Maybe there's a list of taste/ph data somewhere that I just haven't found?  :unsure:  Any advice appreciated  :)

 

Thanks!

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The wiki pages are up to date for this information and can explain things better than I can.

http://wiki.terrafirmacraft.com/Skill

http://wiki.terrafirmacraft.com/Food

Tastes are all reported as relative. There is an absolute default value, but that value does not matter to the player. Only the relative value matters. So it is entirely possible to see sugar as Not Sweet.

The Not, Perfectly, Ridiculously, etc. adjectives you get that relate to a range of how far from the desired taste you are. When you hit Master you get very clear values allowing you to better predict the outcome.

The way I understand it (totally fictitious example and actual numbers are likely vastly different) you could have a Taste profile that likes a sweetness of 120. If you take 5 foods that have each a sweetness of 100 (so they all have Not Sweet tooltip) and make a sandwich their values are added. So the sandwich would have sweetness of 500, well over your desired sweetness.

It is drainage (how much thick the gravel layer) and pH. I'm not sure how pH is determined or if it can be changed. However you definitely can effect drainage by changing the thickness of gravel under the farmland.

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Thanks for the reply Bunsan :)  

 

I have read the wiki and I think I understand taste profiles, but I'm not sure whether I'm just unlucky that *everything* in my profile is up at the high end and therefore giving me the exact problem you describe, or whether I've just managed to create flavourless growing conditions. Master skill seems unlikely to help since so few things are within 20 of my preferred tastes - unless it would allow me to see beyond the 20 limit? If so then I will go into a cooking overdrive next spring and get rid of all the pickled stuff I've had in storage for 2 years :)

 

I appreciate all taste is relative, but if there was a published list which said, for example, that before pH and drainage values are accounted for, strawberries default to 50 sweetness, blackberries to 40, etc, then I could look at putting together salads that would add up to certain values (roughly) and glean from that what sort of profile my character has, which would then help enormously with planning meals. As it stands I'm down to randomly combining ingredients and saying "I guess strawberries are sweet ish"...

 

It is drainage (how much thick the gravel layer) and pH. I'm not sure how pH is determined or if it can be changed. However you definitely can effect drainage by changing the thickness of gravel under the farmland.

 

I hadn't thought about drainage... I will try messing with that some time. And I kind of assumed that types of soil/rock would have a specific pH value... but I could be totally wrong ^^;  In my head, limestone would be heavily alkaline, and basalt say, would be quite acidic - but I'll have another read around and see what I can find about pH determination.

 

Thanks!

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Only place you find hard numbers are in the code. We don't allow hard numbers like that to be posted on wiki or forums as it can ruin the fun for some players. Players who are interested are directed to the code repository on GitHub.

If you pop on irc frequently someone can direct you to the relevant classes, just be patient as it can sometimes take a long time (hours to even a day) for someone with knowledge to respond.

As for master it will give you hard numbers for the taste. Remember the taste being close to your taste profile provides bonus saturation. So don't kill yourself looking for the perfect food. Think of it as a way to pair foods so they can be a bit better.

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Aha, ok - I can respect a challenge that only dedicated peeps will rise to, I just wanted to be sure that it was intended rather than the result of an unlucky dice roll (or me not knowing something) :)

 

Half way through expert cooking now, and it's early autumn in my game, so the harvest and barbecue fest shall soon be upon me ^^

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Waiting for confirmation from Bioxx, but I'm 90% sure that pH is purely determined at random by chunk locations, and has absolutely nothing to do with the soil type of the area. I know for a fact that the pH of an area cannot be altered, so it does not matter if you dig up all the dirt in the area and place a different type of dirt down. The pH will still be the same.

 

This is the link for all the taste values in the code. I have put it in a spoiler tag for those who do not want to see the exact numbers, as they can generally be guessed because they are based off of reality and the system can be fully utilized without knowing them.

 

https://github.com/Deadrik/TFCraft/blob/master/src/Common/com/bioxx/tfc/ItemSetup.java#L791

 

If you don't know how to read that and get the taste values from it, just hop in IRC and I'd be happy to explain it to you.

 

It's also important to note that if you have two pieces of the same food that have different taste values due to differences in pH or drainage when harvested, and you combine them together into a single stack of food, it does not combine or average the tastes, it simply reverts the profile of that food to the default values.

Edited by Kittychanley
Confirmed
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Waiting for confirmation from Bioxx, but I'm 90% sure that pH is purely determined at random by chunk locations, and has absolutely nothing to do with the soil type of the area. I know for a fact that the pH of an area cannot be altered, so it does not matter if you dig up all the dirt in the area and place a different type of dirt down. The pH will still be the same.

 

This is the link for all the taste values in the code. I have put it in a spoiler tag for those who do not want to see the exact numbers, as they can generally be guessed because they are based off of reality and the system can be fully utilized without knowing them.

 

Thanks Kitty, that's useful to know. I actually figured out how to use the relative flavours once you have master level cooking to figure out both the absolute values of each food, and your own player profile, which gave me somewhat better sandwiches.

 

I then went slightly mad, databased and cross joined everything I had in my cellar, at various stages of cooking and preparation, and produced a sandwich with all five food groups, three perfect tastes, and the other two within ten points. T'was satisfying :)

 

Then I realised that it was only applicable when cooking over maple wood... and I just wasn't prepared to collect any more data points  :blink:

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