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Jed1314

Combat Overhaul final (3/3)

72 posts in this topic

Oooh you can actually code ? :D

Yes self taught mostly but going to do it at uni :)

Well then, you'll know what you need more than me, but I really hope that Bioxx does implement a good amount of support for addon devs. There's so many suggestions here which deserve to exist. Even ones I wouldn't use personally :P

Even if he doesn't WE WILL STILL MOD HIS MOD... unless he asks nicely :P

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Yes self taught mostly but going to do it at uni :)

Even if he doesn't WE WILL STILL MOD HIS MOD... unless he asks nicely :P

Good luck with that mate, I wish you all the best :)

Tell you what then, if/when he allows add-ons, I'll come to you with all my ridiculous ideas :P

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Good luck with that mate, I wish you all the best :)

Tell you what then, if/when he allows add-ons, I'll come to you with all my ridiculous ideas :P

And I will make a ridiculous estimation of when they will be done. :)

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And I will make a ridiculous estimation of when they will be done. :)

What like "Yeah I should have that done in about 5 hours" 3 weeks pass .. "I encountered some unexpected issues" :)
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What like "Yeah I should have that done in about 5 hours" 3 weeks pass .. "I encountered some unexpected issues" :)

Yes it's called that uni test that I haven't studied for. :P

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Yes it's called that uni test that I haven't studied for. :P

You mean all of them ? :D
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yes, yes this is all good and i'll probably be working on something related to this in the future once the animals are all working right

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yes, yes this is all good and i'll probably be working on something related to this in the future once the animals are all working right

Not going to lie, I'm a little chuffed with myself about this comment :P

Thanks ! :)

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I like your combat rebalance threads, or at least the idea of making vanilla combat not... sucky. But for armor wouldn't it be simpler just to make you move slower the more, and heavier, armor you have on? Certainly you shouldn't be able to sprint in full plate, at least.

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While not a necro as you bring information don't expect a response. Jed only posts once in a blue moon. Check the date. That is a lot longer than it seems.

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Yeah, I wasn't really expecting any, I seem to accidentally have posted on several old threads after looking at the suggestions index post stickied at the top of the page, sorry.

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also to note, the speed someone travels in heavy armor is only reduced by a small amount.

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also to note, the speed someone travels in heavy armor is only reduced by a small amount.

But you wouldn't be able to run for nearly as long would you? While you might not go any/much slower, your stamina would be much lower.

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True, perhaps, but your stamina is vastly reduced as you carry a LOT of load in areas you don't normally carry them - your legs and arms. I recently saw a study that said that reenactors burned twice as many calories on a treadmill wearing full armor versus CARRYING it on their backs in packs. Obviously both are much worse than not having all that weight at all. Knights might be able to sprint at near the speed of an unarmored person (which, honestly, seems rather unlikely to me but w/e) but they sure as all couldn't do it for very long. Just like they couldn't jog, or even walk, as long as an unarmored soldier. That's why they went everywhere on horses; they're carrying a heavy load, and they're carrying it in all the wrong places.

On top of that, I think the speed comment applies to people who are CONDITIONED to traveling in all that armor. There being no stat or skill progression, steve can't exactly become conditioned, which means he would perform about as well as any average joe who put on a suit of steel which, I think it's fair to say, is horribly. EDIT: I think I thought of a better way to express this issue. I'm assuming you or someone else you've talked to on the forums is a reenactor, and you're going based on real world experience, and you've seen people in armor move about as fast as people without. You're talking someone who is conditioned to do that, however. So how fast did the person in plate armor sprint compared to a competitive sprinter? How fast was his 'cruise' speed when jogging long distances compared to a cross country or marathon runner? I think you're comparing someone who is conditioned to do what they do to the average person (who's conditioned to sit on the couch watching opra and shoveling twinkies :P ), as opposed to others similarly accustomed, which would be the equal scale.

Still, though, a stamina system would probably be a pain to implement. This is probably why so many games use that mechanic of just slowing people down as they put on more armor - it makes sense, and it's relatively easy to do compared to coding something to represent how quickly the armored player gets tired, how much his mobility is hurt by all that weight at the extremities, how much his flexibility is hurt by having limiting artificial armor joints tacked over his own, etc. Much simpler to just say, "You take half the damage, so you go half as fast." Instant gameplay depth as players chose between mobility and survivability.

If people were absolutely against that, and coding all the other drawbacks of full plate armor which would have made it absolutely useless in a world (such as tfc) that had no horses to get the knights where they needed to go was too much of a pain, it shouldn't be too hard to at least partially represent the limited agility of a person encased in steel. Simply reduce the secondary movements - a player can move forward and turn just as fast, or at a slightly reduced speed, but his sidestep and jump are greatly reduced, as well as his backwards speed.

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I really think this need to be seen again anyways.

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Wasn't combat overhaul along these lines horribly and brutally murdered by Bioxx? Just saying, although I don't agree with Bioxx on this point there isn't a whole lot of sense behind continuing this discussion.

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I don't care, Dunk disagrees with Bioxx on this one and so does the entire community, in the end it is HIS mod, but certain things are just silly.

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I believe that no matter what a person says, you can change thier mind if given time and the proper amount of persistence.

in other words, Im going to ask him about a few threads some time later if I remember too ^^

yay for the IRC :)

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I believe that no matter what a person says, you can change thier mind if given time and the proper amount of persistence.

in other words, Im going to ask him about a few threads some time later if I remember too ^^

yay for the IRC :)

I think I agree with you guys about arguing this point only, I usually don't support pushing something that has already been shot down, but I think an exception is in order for this. So, GIVE ME BETTER COMBAT BIOXX!!!!! (JK, ofc I can't make you do that, but it would be very nice if you did. Or at least a greater variety of weapons. :))

Anyways, I retract my previous post, and officially support your cause, ECC and everyone else of this opinion, for better or for worse. Even if Bioxx hates me for it. (I won't get that pushy, I understand if you don't change your mind and I have said before a few times why I support many of you decisions despite the fact I'm not completely happy with what that decision is) Also, I don't know why I'm talking like Bioxx will actually see, and respond to this, but it felt like the only way to write it.

(Disclaimer: I don't have the will, or the time tbh, to actively support this opinion. Just know that I support it, and if compelled will actively support it. Also, I may change my mind at some point too. :P)

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Guys, if Bioxx shot this down, that is his business ! :L .. I don't want my suggestion forced on him :( .. Ultimately, it is his mod and he should stick to what he thinks is right :)

By the way, I am honoured that a thread this old of mine was deemed worth rezzing :')

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Guys, if Bioxx shot this down, that is his business ! :L .. I don't want my suggestion forced on him :( .. Ultimately, it is his mod and he should stick to what he thinks is right :)

By the way, I am honoured that a thread this old of mine was deemed worth rezzing :')

I don't think anyone here is going to force it on him (I was joking in parts of my above post, just to be clear :P). I just think that as something many people feel is important to TFC, we should let Bioxx know that this is something we believe is important. Another fact to consider is that TFC has limited compatibility so many of the mods that improve combat in some way are not available for various reasons (adds something that conflicts with TFC, requires items not obtainable without cheating in TFC, etc.). I also don't think Bioxx should be forced into anything, and I am firmly supportive of Bioxx doing what he wants, after all it's his mod (as you said). I just think that in certain cases (this is the only one I've seen so far, combat overhaul is almost universally supported among people here.) he should be made well aware that the choice he has made does not sit well with the players and after that, well, honestly we can't do anything after that but hope he changes his mind. In the end I will still play TFC if it has better combat or not, I would just prefer if exploring a cave didn't require me to buy a new mouse because my left click doesn't work anymore.

So yeah, I don't want to come across like I'm forcing this suggestion, as I am usually a strong advocate of taking what Bioxx said (said by him directly or through Dunk) and leaving it at that. But this situation is different, and Bioxx needs to be aware of that and hopefully at least he will reconsider his choice, even if he sticks with his original decision in the end.

(I guess I'm just trying to justify my complete change of opinion on this matter, I still don't quite understand it myself... )

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I don't think anyone here is going to force it on him (I was joking in parts of my above post, just to be clear :P). I just think that as something many people feel is important to TFC, we should let Bioxx know that this is something we believe is important. Another fact to consider is that TFC has limited compatibility so many of the mods that improve combat in some way are not available for various reasons (adds something that conflicts with TFC, requires items not obtainable without cheating in TFC, etc.). I also don't think Bioxx should be forced into anything, and I am firmly supportive of Bioxx doing what he wants, after all it's his mod (as you said). I just think that in certain cases (this is the only one I've seen so far, combat overhaul is almost universally supported among people here.) he should be made well aware that the choice he has made does not sit well with the players and after that, well, honestly we can't do anything after that but hope he changes his mind. In the end I will still play TFC if it has better combat or not, I would just prefer if exploring a cave didn't require me to buy a new mouse because my left click doesn't work anymore.

So yeah, I don't want to come across like I'm forcing this suggestion, as I am usually a strong advocate of taking what Bioxx said (said by him directly or through Dunk) and leaving it at that. But this situation is different, and Bioxx needs to be aware of that and hopefully at least he will reconsider his choice, even if he sticks with his original decision in the end.

(I guess I'm just trying to justify my complete change of opinion on this matter, I still don't quite understand it myself... )

Well put ! .. Ok then :)

To be fair, it would be awesome to have overhaul looked at again ¬.¬ ... I'd really like some more varied ranged combat ¬.¬ :P

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if not the overhaul, my smaller topic which is a simplified version of this would be very nice :)

getting the +1 from the devs on either would be very much appreciated.

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if not the overhaul, my smaller topic which is a simplified version of this would be very nice :)

getting the +1 from the devs on either would be very much appreciated.

No offense, but i prefer Jed's overhaul... it's like choosing between the demo and full version when you don't have to pay or do anything different to get any of those ._.

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