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Scooterdanny

Additional Chisel Functions

   65 members have voted

  1. 1. Subdividing blocks into "cubits" increases bandwidth use because each time a "cubit block" is edited, the server needs to send the aditional 1000 bits to your client (assuming for 10x10x10 blocks). (-Dunk)

    • Yes, totally worth it
      58
    • No, please don't
      6

Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

79 posts in this topic

Basically, i love the chisel, i love all the innovation one can use when working on stone, however, i would like to see more functions added to it, Such as;

-Ability to work more materials in slab mode, such as wood

-A new mode that allows you to take of small cubits off of a block, rather than entire planes. IE blocks would be made of something like 16x16 little sections that you could individually remove. (not my idea, just wanted to bring it to the surface again) If you have ever seen the thread about chisel productions, and how amazing they look, imagine if this were added.

-Ability to make Statues (if the above idea was implemented, then scratch this idea.)

-Engraving, (not original, but wanted an organized home for the suggestions) i must re-create my dwarf fortress in MC.

-Cutting Gems, i mean, how often is a gem straight from stone ever perfectly cut? make all gems uncut to start with, and add a minigame or similar, to cut the gem.

- True Woodworking, as in roughing, smoothing wood, even making constructions that require no nails, or screws, as they lock together like a jigsaw puzzle (i'm being honest, this is a real thing, and works extremely well.)

That's all i can think of at the moment, and if anyone has made a post similar to this already, i apologize, i thoroughly checked the search results, and found nothing of the sort.

Edited by dunkleosteus
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+1 I too need to recreate my fortress in MC .. That said, I'm not that experienced with DF so it's not great :L

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I strongly endorse this. The chisel is one of the most emergent parts of TFC, and I would really like to be able to do even more decorative stuff wif it. *taps fingertips together* Also, I'm betting that woodworking is already on the collective dev mind. My viking longhouse would profit from a little more detail. :)

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I haven't even played DF, so... ._.

Let's see...

-I think the saw would be more suitable for wood than a chisel... Just saying :

-Nothing to say, except it was already suggested, but you already said that ._.

-It would be cool if you could "program" something in a chisel, so you would first make a statue by yourself, then "program" it in the chisel, and then you could, when you set it mode to "statue", make a copy of what you had made before without actually having to make it again. Though, maybe that's suitable for another mod, it seems a bit too easy for TFC ._.

-Same as the second one.

Other than that, i think these things could be pretty cool :3

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Woodworking

A sharp wood chisel in combination with a forstner wood drill bit is used to form this mortise for a half-lap joint in a timber frame.

A worker uses a chisel to put the finishing touches on a dovetail joint for a timber frame.

Woodworking chisels range from small hand tools for tiny details, to large chisels used to remove big sections of wood, in 'roughing out' the shape of a pattern or design. Typically, in woodcarving, one starts with a larger tool, and gradually progresses to smaller tools to finish the detail. One of the largest types of chisel is the slick, used in timber frame construction and wooden shipbuilding. There are many types of woodworking chisels used for specific purposes, such as:

butt chisel: short chisel with beveled sides and straight edge for creating joints.

carving chisels: used for intricate designs and sculpting; cutting edges are many; such as gouge, skew, parting, straight, paring, and V-groove.

corner chisel: resembles a punch and has an L-shaped cutting edge. Cleans out square holes, mortises and corners with 90 degree angles.

bevel edge chisel: can get into acute angles with its bevelled edges.

flooring chisel: cuts and lifts flooring materials for removal and repair; ideal for tongue-and-groove flooring.

framing chisel: usually used with mallet; similar to a butt chisel, except it has a longer, slightly flexible blade.

slick: a large chisel driven by manual pressure, never struck.

mortise chisel: thick, rigid blade with straight cutting edge and deep, slightly tapered sides to make mortises and similar joints.

paring chisel: has a long blade which is ideal for cleaning grooves and accessing tight spaces.

skew chisel: has a 60 degree cutting angle and is used for trimming and finishing.

dovetail chisel: Made specifically for cutting dovetail joints. The difference being the thickness of the body of the chisel, as well as the angle of the edges, permitting easier access to the joint.

I disagree, chisels are very often used for making/shaping wood

Also, will be editing the OP occasionally, so as to keep it tidy. and up to date with suggestions.

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Woodworking

A sharp wood chisel in combination with a forstner wood drill bit is used to form this mortise for a half-lap joint in a timber frame.

A worker uses a chisel to put the finishing touches on a dovetail joint for a timber frame.

Woodworking chisels range from small hand tools for tiny details, to large chisels used to remove big sections of wood, in 'roughing out' the shape of a pattern or design. Typically, in woodcarving, one starts with a larger tool, and gradually progresses to smaller tools to finish the detail. One of the largest types of chisel is the slick, used in timber frame construction and wooden shipbuilding. There are many types of woodworking chisels used for specific purposes, such as:

butt chisel: short chisel with beveled sides and straight edge for creating joints.

carving chisels: used for intricate designs and sculpting; cutting edges are many; such as gouge, skew, parting, straight, paring, and V-groove.

corner chisel: resembles a punch and has an L-shaped cutting edge. Cleans out square holes, mortises and corners with 90 degree angles.

bevel edge chisel: can get into acute angles with its bevelled edges.

flooring chisel: cuts and lifts flooring materials for removal and repair; ideal for tongue-and-groove flooring.

framing chisel: usually used with mallet; similar to a butt chisel, except it has a longer, slightly flexible blade.

slick: a large chisel driven by manual pressure, never struck.

mortise chisel: thick, rigid blade with straight cutting edge and deep, slightly tapered sides to make mortises and similar joints.

paring chisel: has a long blade which is ideal for cleaning grooves and accessing tight spaces.

skew chisel: has a 60 degree cutting angle and is used for trimming and finishing.

dovetail chisel: Made specifically for cutting dovetail joints. The difference being the thickness of the body of the chisel, as well as the angle of the edges, permitting easier access to the joint.

I disagree, chisels are very often used for making/shaping wood

Also, will be editing the OP occasionally, so as to keep it tidy. and up to date with suggestions.

... : I still think the saw should work with wood as the chisel with stone RIGHT NOW. For more detailed things, however, as many of those you suggest up there, it would be ok to use the chisel.

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Well, for simplicity's sake, i would leave the chisel as one item. also a saw is only for cutting more or less straight lines in wood, one also needs things like sanders, and smoothing tools, have you tried cutting wood at angles not perfectly straight? it just won't work :/ and you are likely to cut yourself.

Edited by Scooterdanny
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I think there's just a lack of realization that stone chisels and wood chisels are different in design. Using a stone chisel on wood isn't going to work very well if at all. I think someone somewhere suggested a plane. Maybe down the road a separate set of carpentry tools or at least a carpentry-only workbench.

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No, i realize this, but we don't have ten different axes, or picks, but the point stands i suppose, for slab mode i think a saw would work well actually lol

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I suggested these exact ideas to Bioxx, but after consulting with him a little bit, he made me realize how hard this would actually be. (not from a coding perspective, more from a realistic one. For example, the collision surface of a block has to be a 6 sided regular prism, Which means only permutations of layers, no individual chunks. (We could do it, but it would mean carving out the inside of a block wouldn't change how you collided with it, you wouldn't be able to stand in it). I like the wood idea though. The gems might come into play if we can figure out a proper way to use them. (no point going to the trouble of coding it if it has no use)

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I would be fine with the collisions being planar, i want to make statues really, and more detailed colloums.

I mean, really, imagine walking into a town, and seeing a 3x size replica of steve in armor, or entering a palace, and there being stone lions guarding it, and even things like a museum, or an art gallery. The positive ramifications are far reaching.

Edited by Scooterdanny
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I would be fine with the collisions being planar, i want to make statues really, and more detailed colloums.

I mean, really, imagine walking into a town, and seeing a 3x size replica of steve in armor, or entering a palace, and there being stone lions guarding it, and even things like a museum, or an art gallery. The positive ramifications are far reaching.

SMP servers would open up possibilities as well, as it allows for actual skill trades. Some one good at carving could actually be hired to make statues for someone's house.

This is also why I feel that the difficulty have blacksmithing should be increased (I don't think Bioxx supports this though) I think that it should be a select trade, that only someone who has done a lot of smithing in TFC could ever be good at. That way, a server could have a dedicated blacksmith, who everyone brings ore to, and who makes tools per their specifications. That would be really cool and fun.

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All of the yes, i wholly support difficult skill trades for SMP, so that there cannot be jack of all trades easily. and i am open to making smithing harder, or make it a plugin.

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I would be fine with the collisions being planar, i want to make statues really, and more detailed colloums.

I mean, really, imagine walking into a town, and seeing a 3x size replica of steve in armor, or entering a palace, and there being stone lions guarding it, and even things like a museum, or an art gallery. The positive ramifications are far reaching.

*columns

And yes, I agree.

Perhaps a separate chisel mode could be used for non-colliding microblocks

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... wouldn't making smithing harder make those who really suck at it stay longer in the stone age, if ever make it out of there?

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*columns

And yes, I agree.

Perhaps a separate chisel mode could be used for non-colliding microblocks

Thank you, i could not figure out how to spell it for the life of me.

and hmm, that there is using your noggin' :D

also, i think that making smithing harder should be done only for smp, as in ssp, it would be very hard to progress due to the lack of players helping.

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... wouldn't making smithing harder make those who really suck at it stay longer in the stone age, if ever make it out of there?

I don't know if we're trying to make this a different game on SSP/SMP. I know the kingdoms update centres heavilly on SMP, but I think it does this without changing anything that exists on SSP as well. We don't really want to make two different games. I think the problems people have with smithing are a result of not having a proper understanding of how to smith. And I don't mean tedium and indecipherable instructions, I mean more intricate things. The whole GUI itself could be improved, but I think that's beyond us right now. If you look at history, you will see that a suit of armour was incredibly expensive, while in contrast, swords were relatively affordable for a middle class citizen. A well made suit of armour would have had hundreds of hours of work put into it. Due to vast discrepancies in the wealth of the wealthy and the poor in those times, the nobles who became knights were the only ones who could afford such expensive gear, today, private jets are about the same relative value, and that's because the skills of the blacksmiths who made it were so finely honed and skilled.

What I would like to see in the future of TFC is customization. The statue idea adds some of this, as it places the skill in the hands of the player, not their character. We want people to achieve things through their own hardwork. So while good statue makers might be able to craft better looking statues than other people, I think that blacksmithing should be an incredibly in-depth system. I don't want to bang metal on an anvil and come out with the same sword as my neighbour (even if the health bar is slightly different). With the additions suggested in the combat system, I think this could evolve into so much more. I think that things such as the length and angle of the edge could come into play. The weight, how it is distributed and the tapering of the blade. Your sword could be long and thin, making it quick and agile, but sacrificing strength against heavy or tough objects.

This gives armour possibilities up the wazoo. You could decide how you want it to look, (I'm sure a sprite could be generated based on a 2D rendering of what you make). This would allow you to customize how much material you put into it, which affects how heavy it is, how maneuverable you are while wearing it, but also how well it protects you, how likely it is to protect you (10 kilos of metal on your shoulders won't help your torso). Filigree and aesthetics also come into play, as you can shape this armour however you like. (with sufficient skill) you could craft a steel eagle into your helmet or a lion's head. You could encrust it with gems or trim it with gold. You would be able to mix and match plate and lighter armours to make the best armour you could.

So you see, this whole thing introduces a level of skill that is beyond minecraft and even TFC. This also ties back into the kingdoms phase, as it introduces more things to do

or to trade.

Basically, I want every single aspect of TFC to have incredible depth and detail, so that you never run out of things to do. The closer you look, the more you see.

Sorry for going off topic, but it sort of ties in.

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Off topic?!? WHO CARES? This looks great!

I think the effusiveness of my first posts here is due to the fact that I'm new to the mod and you're making the game I always wanted to play. The nuances of each new TFC system put skill back into the hands of the player, and I think that makes for more engaging gameplay. I'm very keen on effort=reward, so the ideas here regarding customizability and expense in crafting are spot on in my book. I would like to be able to survive well in single player. So long as MP features don't take that away from me, I'm a happy gamer.

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snip

I think i just wet myself, this is EXACTLY what minecraft should be. and if you can swing that, then all hail Dunkleosteus! that amount of customization would be absolutely brilliant, and you convinced me, smithing should be harder.
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... That sounds AWESOME. In the other hand... Bioxx, Dunk, and every other devs working in Terrafirmacraft, you simply take minecraft for creating the game because it was easier than starting from 0? This in no way sounds like vanilla is. The mod is getting more far and far away from the game it modifies in each update, and the updates are pretty common. This deserves to be called the game of the year... or it would deserve it, if what Dunk just said was already implemented, and if it was independant of minecraft :

It sounds like a realistic simulator of the middle ages. I'm loving it.

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And if anything, greaten the damage done to botched forging so people could get out of the stone ages in SP without a ton of skill, but it will cost over half the uses of the tool. This then gives incentives to players to smith more often, in turn heightening that players own gameplay mechanic skill. If people choose to not care about the smith training, they can go on with sub-par weaponry without getting forced into a skill they don't necessarily require

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Erm... i don't know about that, i mean i get within 1 mm of the target and still take a fair bit of weapon damage, just make it harder to get in the margins.

Back to the topic: So, how 'bout them chisels?

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We would go beyond the current botching. The smithing interface would most likely look completely different, but nothing's been worked out so far. Instead of a loss of durability or something like that, (because of course, you're actually shaping the tool into it's final product) you might make it too blunt, or have the balance wrong. The resulting tool would be uniquely worse than all other tools. It might have a lower durability to begin with (ie, two max health pickaxes, [one shitty, one not] wouldn't be able to mine the same amount of rock before breaking), might be slower at swinging or at destroying blocks, might do less damage if it's a weapon, or might be more prone to taking more damage. This encourages you to try new things and experiment to see what works best when making the tools.

So you see the benefits and deficits are more extreme. This increases the usefulness of each player on a server, and encourages specialization. You might see forum posts advertising "SMP Server, good blacksmith needed!" or "Big server, need carpenters!". I really like the idea of each person being individually useful, as it encourages unity and cooperation within the kingdoms, and as well, between towns and villages within the server.

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Shut up and take my likes! XD

If only i could give more, darn quota!

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Shut up and take my likes! XD

If only i could give more, darn quota!

I know that feel bro D':

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