Cave ins

[Treyflix 277]

If you use a chisel to smooth a block that might cause a cave in and THEN break it as smooth stone, will that prevent any chance of a cave in happening?

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

I don't think so... i think the blocks AROUND the one you break are the ones who check -in short- if a cave-in should occur or shouldn't.

[Treyflix 277]

But cave ins do not happen when digging out ores or making a 2x1 tunnel?

[Jasnatdic 85]

A cave in can happen in ore or any other "rock" type under ground, a cave in will only happen if you are digging wall or ceiling. In other words you cant cause a cave in by digging on the floor. The best and really only way to prevent a cave in is to use supports to shore up as you dig.

As far as a cave in occurring in a 1 wide 2 high tunnel, I'm not sure on the coding of this currently, but in the past I have seen cave ins occur in1 wide tunnels so I am pretty sure that the only way to prevent them is to use supports, or just risk being buried alive.

A last note is, if ore caves in it is ruined, and turns into cobble of the rock type the ore is mimicking.

[psychotimo 5]

just make sure to use supports if you're mining upwards, as long as you're mining downwards... don't bother (in small tunnels ofc at max 2x2)

i've spent a lot of time mining and never even once had a cave-in, i automatically mine the upper block first (just the power of the hobbit ...erm i mean the power of habit ^^ )

and tbh i've NEVER seen a cave-in happen in a 2x1 tunnel, i've triggered a few on purpose but those were all in 2x3 areas (at least) so i presumed that everything up until 2x2 was safe and never had any cave-ins till now. but that could be because i always start by mining the upper block first ^^ as long as you do that all of your tunnels should be safe unless you're making them too wide^^

[Enzer 60]

I've had cave ins occur in 2x1 tunnels as of revision 47f both in ssp and smp. They do not occur as often (only because you are not mining out as much stone to go further as you would a 2x2 or 3x3 tunnel, I think), but they do occur and when they do it sucks because there is much less room to maneuver and you are mostly likely going to get crushed at that point.

[sdbaynham 57]

A cave in can happen in ore

False. Cave-ins only happen if you dig natural stone that is horizontally adjacent to a collapsible block without anything below it. I do believe that smoothing a block before digging it will prevent caveins, and I know there are some players on my server who keep a chisel with them while mining for exactly that purpose (but don't know whether they achieve any actual success).

[Jasnatdic 85]

False. Cave-ins only happen if you dig natural stone that is horizontally adjacent to a collapsible block without anything below it. I do believe that smoothing a block before digging it will prevent caveins, and I know there are some players on my server who keep a chisel with them while mining for exactly that purpose (but don't know whether they achieve any actual success).

Not false, if the ore is beside the cave in and gets randomly triggered for the cave in to continue then the ore collapses into cobble, hence cave ins can happen in ore. You can argue the opposite all you want but the fact is I have watched ore collapse into oblivion. Also while the trigger might be a unsupported horizontal natural stone block the continued collapse isn't strictly horizontal.

As far as chiseling out stone to smooth to prevent collapses I'm quite sure that will go away when the building changes take place.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Not false, if the ore is beside the cave in and gets randomly triggered for the cave in to continue then the ore collapses into cobble, hence cave ins can happen in ore. You can argue the opposite all you want but the fact is I have watched ore collapse into oblivion. Also while the trigger might be a unsupported horizontal natural stone block the continued collapse isn't strictly horizontal.

As far as chiseling out stone to smooth to prevent collapses I'm quite sure that will go away when the building changes take place.

probably not

[sdbaynham 57]

Not false, if the ore is beside the cave in and gets randomly triggered for the cave in to continue then the ore collapses into cobble, hence cave ins can happen in ore. You can argue the opposite all you want but the fact is I have watched ore collapse into oblivion. Also while the trigger might be a unsupported horizontal natural stone block the continued collapse isn't strictly horizontal.

As far as chiseling out stone to smooth to prevent collapses I'm quite sure that will go away when the building changes take place.

Mining ore will not cause a cavein. As asserted by the poster you originally responded to.

EDIT: I'd highly recommend ya'll play at 100% caveins - you'll dispense with the sort of magical thinking on display in this thread pretty quickly. Dig top to bottom, don't dig a natural stone block with air below it, or that's next to a block with air below it. It's a pretty simple system, with easy to follow rules.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Mining ore will not cause a cavein. As asserted by the poster you originally responded to.

Mining ore can't cause a cave in, but mining rock around ore might, but I'm not entirely sure. I wouldn't suggest mining the ore around an ore block before you mine the ore itself. Don't quote me on that though.

[sdbaynham 57]

To be honest, I'm pretty skeptical about ore being picked up in cave-ins at least in the latest builds. I don't feel confident enough in my knowledge about how cave-ins spread to say one way or the other, though. I do know there's a (HATED) contingent of players on DigHissBoom who mine with cave-ins intentionally because of its effectiveness in exposing ore veins.

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

I have mined sphalerite myself from the roof of a giant cave. cave-ins happened, like, a million times. Not even one of them actually affected ore blocks, only those around.

[cevkiv 156]

Yeah, I've never seen ore cave-in, and I used to follow the "can't find it with the propick? CAVE-IN TIME" school of mining.

[warfighter67 124]

I have it confirmed from Bioxx awhile ago on IRC that caveins do not happen in ore and caveins do not destroy ore. And, as the guy above me does, sometimes I even purposely attempt to make a cavein to find ore.

[Chezzik 22]

I'm pretty sure that one of the Spotter videos is responsible for spreading the rumor that ore crumbles into cobblestone. I had pretty much accepted it as fact until seeing this thread.

Edit: Yep, he states it

. Good to know that I'm not going insane

[cevkiv 156]

And by "I've never seen ore cave in, I mean I have literally seen rock below the ore fall, and rock above the ore fall, but the ore stays the same.

[Chezzik 22]

EDIT: I'd highly recommend ya'll play at 100% caveins - you'll dispense with the sort of magical thinking on display in this thread pretty quickly. Dig top to bottom, don't dig a natural stone block with air below it, or that's next to a block with air below it. It's a pretty simple system, with easy to follow rules.

Best advice ever. Thanks!

You change that option in the TFCOptions.cfg file. The normal cave-in probability is 1/40. I changed it to 1/1 today, and learned a lot. Warning: Spoilers ahead!

When you mine a solid block, it can only cause a cave-in if the block above it is not air, and the block below it is air. This means you can make giant rooms of any size with out any supports. Just dig out the top two layers first, and always dig the top block in the layer, and then the bottom. You can make it 50x50x2 if you want without any supports. After you do this, just dig down, and expand it to 50x50x50, if you want, all without supports. I'm not sure if this is an exploit or not. I kind of doubt that it's functioning as envisioned.

As far as digging 2x1 shafts, they can collapse, but won't if you do it correctly. As I illustrated in the last paragraph, if you always dig the top block and then the one below it, then you are safe. I also found that if you dig the bottom one first and then the top, then you are also safe. So how do you cause a cave-in in a 2x1 shaft? Stand at the end, with your face against the wall. Dig 2 forward at foot level. Now, dig the one at face level. This caused cave-ins for me every single time (when changing that option as suggested above).

So, when are supports necessary? When you dig up, or when you want to make a dirt roof. That's about it.

[GCountach 39]

You know how else you can cause a cave-in with 2x1 shafts? Digging one into a pre-generated cave if you dig into the ceiling. That's when supports are handy (if you hear zombies for example near you and you've lit your area up well). I rather not play the odds that I'll have a place to stand once the cave-in's start. Massive caves aren't necessary. The tiny ones full of water is enough.