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Srgnoodles

Pre-Stone Age Weaponry

19 posts in this topic

i was thinking that there should be more weaponry options before you get to tin to make swords out of

sticks: simple, hitting someone with a stick ought to do more damage than punching them

rocks: i saw this idea somewhere else, throwing rocks would do the same damage as fists but at range

wooden sword: these are the only wooden tool that makes sence, not only does a proper handle and blade shape give you more controll over the weapon-thus more damage-, but gives you more durrability than a common stick.

Javalin: more than just a rock stuck to a stick, these should have to be knapped into a javalin head, also should do more damage when going for melee attacks seeing as you're stabbing with a sharpened stone spear-thing -also, off topic a bit, there should be metal javalins that are stronger and have less chance to dissapear on hit-

thats all i can think of at the moment, feel free to post comments, concerns, questions, or rubber duckies

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Well, i think dunk is interested in damages being different depending on the item, IE feathers suck, and a shovel is much better.

Wooden swords, aside from maybe breaking bones, aren't quite leathal. (remember Kendo? those are training swords for a reason.)

I agree javelins should require knapping, but really, knives were quite common pre-stone age.

But atalattles (or however you spell it) and slings were quite common, depending on the location.

But more importantly...

Posted Image

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Well, i think dunk is interested in damages being different depending on the item, IE feathers suck, and a shovel is much better.

Wooden swords, aside from maybe breaking bones, aren't quite leathal. (remember Kendo? those are training swords for a reason.)

I agree javelins should require knapping, but really, knives were quite common pre-stone age.

But atalattles (or however you spell it) and slings were quite common, depending on the location.

well then again hitting someone with a shovel isnt going to be exactly lethal either in those respects, especially a stone one. so why not wooden swords for defending yourself early game, cuz theres not going to be any really crazy mosters untill you dig deeper, just wolves and bears and wild boars (oh my!)
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Imma just wait and see other opinions, as i think a wooden sword is as much work, as a pointy rock on a stick is.

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Clubs made out of cow femur...

Also, watch out cause Bert is gona jack yo rubber ducky of doom up there.

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Wooden Clubs would be more acceptable than wooded swords, I agree. Also, what about Bolas, Boomerang, slingshots, simple traps, actual melee spears, shields (spiked), staff, darts and blowgun, and throwing axes/knives? That's all I can think of right now...

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Wooden Clubs would be more acceptable than wooded swords, I agree. Also, what about Bolas, Boomerang, slingshots, simple traps, actual melee spears, shields (spiked), staff, darts and blowgun, and throwing axes/knives? That's all I can think of right now...

well some of those require more advanced techniques, im thinking of stuff to defend yourself with for the first couple of nights
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Beating cows to death with a stick/throwing a rock = win.

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This is becoming even more desirable with the recent changes in HP and applied damage values from tools/weapons. since fists only apply 1 hp damage which essentially makes them worthless, if the player spawns in a large biome with no trees (particularly near the equator where large distances must be covered to reach cooler climates with trees), then they NEED a viable weapon they can use without sticks or trees to make it, to defend themselves as they seek better locations to settle in.

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I am torn here. I would like to viciously tear this topic apart, but I am also noodles' friend.

For starters, the title "pre-stone age weaponry"... that's rather interesting... There wasn't much in the way of tools before stone at all. As for wooden swords, they are nearly pointless. The skill required to hone a stick to any edge is much greater than is neccesary to make a much more powerful stone weapon, and anything less than that is a wooden club, which isn't any different than how you'd attack with a stick. Further, wooden swords are used for sparring practice entirely because they make such terrible weapons.

I tried to be nice :(

To clarify, I would certainly like to expand the player's options and the time it takes to advance to the metal age (there is evidence that the first bow and arrow was developed more than 70 000 years ago, yet metals were used MAYBE 10 000 years ago, making 60 000 years go by in a fraction of the game play)

I would like to see a game where the first few months maybe even year of the game is spent as a hunter gatherer, fighting off vicious bears in your fur armour equipped only with your spear/javelin. I'd prefer to take TFC along a much more realistic approach. For example, the first "pick axe" was developed from a hoe like object. The antlers of red deer were de-tined and attached to wooden handles (or used on their own) to dig up and til soil for planting crops. Eventually someone discovered that stone could be broken by hitting it with the pointed end of the hoe and they were soon being developed to break rocks which were used to make stone houses and walls. Eventually the rock-work lead people to learn more about masonry and rocks in general, noticing certain properties of individual rocks. They would seek out particular minerals and rocks for building. Further, they found peculiar "veins" of discoloration in the rocks and shiny, reflective flecks. At some point they developed the ability to refine these minerals in large bonfires into what we'd recognize as metals. It is true however that some of the earliest metal tools were developed from native metal deposits on the ground, but these were cold worked in small fires into very basic items such as awls and beads.

Copper was also the first metal to be worked (unless you count isolated pockets of meteoric iron deposits). I mean that copper was the first metal to be worked by peoples who actually developed the craft and who directly contributed to the modern metallurgic understanding. Metals such as bismuth, zinc and tin were unknown at the time, as smelting non native metals was yet to be discovered. In fact, the first tin ingot wasn't produced until well into the reign of the Ancient Greeks, c. 300 BCE? Bronze had been used for more than 1000 years prior to this. Shortly after copper started being used for tools such as hatchets and knives, people started to develop early forms of bronze, starting in most cases with arsenic bronze. Arsenic bronze was rather weak, and the production of it released poisons which sometimes killed the metalworkers. Eventually, an ore was discovered that when added to the copper ore during smelting, seemed to produce a much stronger and robust golden coloured metal. They had discovered true tin bronze, but still hadn't isolated the exact component which produced the bronze (ie the tin) they only knew what rock it was found in.

In actuality, bronze is usually stronger than iron and better as a tool. The reason the iron age comes after the bronze age is the ready availability of iron compared to copper and tin. During the reign of the Roman Empire, they equipped their soldiers with iron armour and weapons, but the officers still received bronze ones. The copper and tin mines that had been used since antiquity were running dry, and on top of that, the old mines and any new ones that were still producing copper efficiently were too far from the capital (a lot in southern spain, iirc) to be used to mass produce weapons and armour. This is why they switched to iron instead.

Once steel was developed, which was better than bronze, bronze work decreased greatly.

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You can make a wooden knife. Not very useful, because to make it you need a stone knife. But I think that it needs to do less damage than a stone knife, but must have more durability, because it's only a piece. Or broken stick. You can get 2 of them from a stick. This can be used like a little spear, but has less damage and durability than a javelin.

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much more realistic approach

ohshit.jpg

But, very well said Dunk! Sounds ambitious, although not out of TFC's reach. After starting a new map a few days ago, it took me like 3 in-game days to get out of the stone age. I agree, it feels rushed and that there should be more time spent progressing through the various eras of technology.

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ohshit.jpg

But, very well said Dunk! Sounds ambitious, although not out of TFC's reach. After starting a new map a few days ago, it took me like 3 in-game days to get out of the stone age. I agree, it feels rushed and that there should be more time spent progressing through the various eras of technology.

Yeah, but I doubt Bioxx would overhaul basic game content this late into development.
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Dunk, if Bioxx goes all the way through beta, you have 7 more. :P

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Dunk, if Bioxx goes all the way through beta, you have 7 more. :P

Huh? Sorry for possibly useless post, but i don't get this. ^^ 7 more what?

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Huh? Sorry for possibly useless post, but i don't get this. ^^ 7 more what?

I think he was refering to "game overhauls"... Not sure though :

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Rather than Pre stone age weaponry, I'd rather see more stone age items.

More wooden and stone weapons and tools.

I'd like to see wood clubs, Mere(stone) clubs and stone headed maces, Fire hardening wooden weaponry/tools for extra durability at a campfire, and maybe a Terbutje/Macuahuitl?

A wood shaping option/bench using a log/plank and a knife, where we can shape wood into other forms, like sticks or handles for weapons.

I'll touch on the Terbutje/Macuahuitl, they look kind of like this:

Posted Image

The teeth for a Terbutje/Macuahuitl club/sword could be made of various types of things:

Stone, true obsidian, gems, diamonds, flint, animal teeth

The crafting grid could be like such: (appologies about the lack of pictures for the crafting box, I'm tired)

123

456

789

1 Teeth

2 Core - Plank

3 Teeth

4 Teeth

5 Core - Plank

6 Teeth

7

8 Handle - Stick/carved wood?

9

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I think he was refering to "game overhauls"... Not sure though :

yeah, I'd really like to know what "7 more" means
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