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Devlin

Archery and Weaponry

15 posts in this topic

OK so just to clarify this is a thread about weapon ideas. Normally I, like everyone else, would sit here, write out some long explanation of what I am thinking and have about 7 different people show up to tear apart my ideas because of something i said. So instead of explaining why i think they should be added or anything like that i will just list a few ideas for anyone to add onto, they are not detailed or refined in anyway so feel free to add on or deconstruct as you see fit..

Archery:

Slingshot: throws rocks, mostly just pisses off mobs

Short bows: basic bow made for beginers

Bow/ strong bow/ hard bow/ whatever: stronger bow made of better material then the short bow, longer range and more damage

Composite bow: same range as the short bow but more damage then the long bow, fires faster.

Crossbow: very very slow fire rate, massive damage, may be able to 2 shot kill a full health player in full iron or 3 shot steel (if you can reload fast enough to shoot them before they run up to you and start beating on you with their steel mace.)

Combat:

Knife should have increased speed.

Maces should inflict a slight miner's fatigue and slow the player's swing. maces and swords should have a 2 block range, swords should have a chance to inflict a bleed effect that deals very minor damage while maces have a slight chance to knock back or stun the enemy slightly more then usual.

Dagger: fast weapon, 1/2 or 1 block range block range

Katana: faster sword that deals slightly less damage, same range as sword and mace

Battleaxe: slower, like the mace but has am increased chance to inflict the bleed effect.

Spear (not javelin): less damage but has increased reach. 4 blocks?

Other:

Throwing knifes/stars: do i really have to explain this one?

Jacks: throw them on the ground. When a mob walks on them they hurt the mob and disappear/ break.

Bleh... i can't really think of more for this but feel free to add

Traps:

Spikes

Skyrim....

you guys can fill this one out.

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doesn't need to be but we want believable right? and having every single weapon be exactly the same is not very believable. plus it would make it that much harder if you had to actually way your options on what you want to do. if your thinking about zombies a sword or spear would be best. for a skeleton bleed would be pointless so the something like a stunning hammer would be best. fending off a creeper? get something with knock back or more reach. range is best for them,. really the only reason i started this was for archery but i had a few ideas for weapons so i thought i would throw them in as well.

basically i just want to make it more immersive. if you have to really think about the weapon you want then it makes it so that the weapons you make have that much more meaning to you as they reflect your personal choice and preference if it is only based on visuals then really there is no attachment to your weapon, but if you have to think about the pros and cons of each weapon type and them make a choice it increase the sentimental value of each weapon you make. yes eventually you will have them all but until then you will really have to consider what you want to spend your hard earned ore an time on. oh and naming them would make this even better. many weapons throughout history have been given names. whether that weapon was lost and broken on a battlefield or preserved forever in a museum. naming a weapon gives it character ad sentimental value.

Edited by Devlin
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TFC is NOT an MMORPG...

I do not get the point.

Before TFC I was playing on servers only with PVP, stealling and griefing being enabled, allowed and encouraged.

The only thing I was missing was a plugin that was going the directions of planetside, forcing the players to fight, attack and defend.

And this would only work - there I might understand you - with a lot of people being online. Maybe 40 slots are not enough and even on a 100+ server I rarely met any other player.

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I agree with adding these weapons. It would be a great idea ad make suvining nights more intrusting. Plus the knife and axe does shit damage and durability.

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As cool as it might seem to have a cool sword and a cool spear and a broken dagger and a battleaxe made of pickles and 9 new types of weaponized pies, do you remember what it's actually like to play Minecraft? Your inventory is already full of tools, stuff you went out into the caverns to get and bring back, stuff that dropped from bad guys, and weapons. Your chest is already full of schematics and half a dozen metals and waaayyy too many seeds. You have to keep track of all that stuff. More stuff makes the game harder, so any new stuff should have a really solid justification for being added. "It would be cool" is too weak a reason.

Here's what you need:

  • ranged weapon
  • melee weapon
  • more expensive upgrades
Vanilla MC has the bow, the sword, and an enchanting system. The enchanting system has been removed from TFC, so the technology you gain gives you the upgrades. Your ranged weapon is the javelin, which aside from being a somewhat poor weapon, won't stack so it clutters your inventory. So you upgrade to a bow. Your melee weapon is a knife, but if you want more damage and durability you make something with steel, etc.

There are 6 tool metals (I think) for a sword and for a mace, so that's 12 weapons. I think we can agree that maces and swords aught to be different in some way, but aside from that why does the game need to add another 6 weapons?

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Have disagree with you there, Bihlbo... I think the reason would be akin to "why add so many metals."

Weapons in the game currently SUCK and are boring as hell, expanding them is totally justified. Also there are not 12 weapons, as the 12 weapons you mention are all the same weapon with the exact same functionality.

Edit: i realize you agree that maces should be changed, so 6 weapons, not 12.

What has been suggested here is an assortment of weapons that each have different traits and uses because circumstances change. (kinda like how we ended up with all these different weapons in real life.)

people shouldnt fear change so much, change can be for better or worse, but stagnation topples empires.

I WILL say however that the katana is a stretch.

I personally hate this trend of video games feeling compelled to add in katanas. they are just swords! dont people get that? they are a sword design that was common in a particular culture. why is everyone so hung up on katanas!? yes they are sleek and elegant and very effective, but that has to do more with their forging and steel and training in use. so this whole katana thing needs to stop... please! i mean we dont add in flamberges or claymores, why dont we tip the hat to THOSE cultures as well? you think a claymore isnt worthy of respect? i am totally appreciative of the awesomeness of katanas... but it is a sword.

totally NOT attacking you personally for the comment, Devlin... I am speaking to the masses on that one.

OH and PS. i think swords should do no damage to players in heavy armour, and have maces do damage instead. Slashing someone in plate doesnt do anything except dull your sword, and poking them will bounce you off into the dirt.

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while i agree that we shouldnt be adding an asstonne of new weapons just because they sound cool, a wide variety of weapons could makie combat a lot more interesting

each weapon would have to be different enough as to warrant its own fighting style, you obviously don't fight the same way with a spear as you would with a sword

in otherwords, no weapon would be a direct upgrade from any other, although some weapons may be more effective against certain enemies (ie: a mace being able to crush skelles, or spears peircing through spiders chitins, goes the other way around too, trying to slash through a spiders exoskelleton woulod be rather difficult with a blade, and pointy weapons would just go right through skelletons-

so, there would be tradeoffs for each weapon, spear sacrifices speed for range, axes/maces sacrifice speed for damage, daggers are fast but weak and short ranged, stuff like that, and swords would pretty much the jack of all trades, having moderate ammounts of speed range and damage

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Well, the game would not be better if the weapon you made out of tin was called a dagger while the weapon you made out of black steel was called a claymore. A tin pointy thing is different than a black steel pointy thing because one does more damage and has more durability than the other. Those are differences enough to make them different weapons, and they are just as meaningful to their use as the differences between a saber and a cutlass, or a mace and a morning star.

If what's being argued is that the 12 or so weapons in the game are too similar to one another, and different traits could be applied to each variation on the combination of the 2 types and 6 metals (I don't know if that's the real number), then I'm all for that. If for instance the difference between a steel sword and a black steel sword were half a heart of damage and 15 points of durability, then they are too similar to be different items. Make the choice between steel and black steel mean something more, like mimicking one of the enchantments that have been removed from the game - and the content that already exists becomes less boring. But the Skyrimening of TFC is just going to result in players feeling the need to carry more weapons than a ranged and a melee option, and that is regressive design in this type of game.

But keep in mind, I don't play TFC to PvP. I could imagine that running around hunting players in armor would benefit from a bunch of very different weapons, especially since your hotbar will be full but the rest of your inventory is totally ignorable. There are better games for that kind of gameplay, and I'm offering that comment up as fact, not just my opinion. But if that's what someone's after I would strongly suggest making a PvP-centered mod for TFC rather than hoping TFC incorporates the support of fringe gameplay at the cost of core design.

And the fringe gameplay vs. core design conflict is the main reason TFC, BTW, and other game-changing mods work great as mods and shouldn't be incorporated into Mojang's product.

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So the game would be better if the weapon you made out of tin was called a dagger while the weapon you made out of black steel was called a claymore?

when did anyone say that?

you could make a black steel dagger or a tin dagger, same goes for a claymore, although i don't think we need to get so comnplex as to have two handed versiouns of all weapons, just enough variety to make things interesting, so that you have to make a choice on what weapon you want to use. this will make things more strategic

plus, my ideas on inventory will make it so you can only carry one or two weapons, not have a whole armoury stuck in your pockets,

im kinda thinking that you could have only what you can carry in your hands, one or two items depending on the size, you could also have backpacks that would be able to hold more

instead of a pack, you could also sling a bow or some sort of weapon on your back, so that you can carry more than just what you are holding. so that clears up people carrying 5 different types of weapon into combat.

and on PVP, i never really PVP much at all, im more focussed on how the player has to react to and fight the mosters of this brave new world they've stumbled into

making a sword out of a different metal, isnt going to change the fact that its a sword, also, in reality, it doesnt make much difference to the damage either, you could have a bronze blade thats just as sharp as a hardened steel blade. the material should really only affect furability and tool quality

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when did anyone say that?

No one did. After I posted I realized that sentence didn't say what I meant it to say, so I edited it. Sorry that you got to it faster than I could correct myself.

while i agree that we shouldnt be adding an asstonne of new weapons just because they sound cool, a wide variety of weapons could makie combat a lot more interesting

This is just like saying that adding a wide variety of digging tools could make mining more interesting. A pick that mines igneous rock really well but does poorly on minerals. A shovel that only harvests clay and peat. A hammer that mows through stalagtites. Come on, that doesn't make the game more interesting, it just makes it a game of changing your gear out as fast as possible. If something needs to be added, it needs to be able to replace the core tool that you would otherwise be using. Not a bow and a sling for when the sling is better - both are ranged weapons and it should be redundant to carry both.
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see, theres a difference between mining and combat, mining is supposed to be hard, difficult, and at times tedious,

fighting is in no way like that. fighting is supposed to be an exciting thing, and honeslty clicking a mob untill it dies isnt my idea of exciting

different forms of weapns will make you have to strategize how you fight, and your preffered style would match the weapon you like best

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see, theres a difference between mining and combat, mining is supposed to be hard, difficult, and at times tedious,

fighting is in no way like that. fighting is supposed to be an exciting thing, and honeslty clicking a mob untill it dies isnt my idea of exciting

different forms of weapns will make you have to strategize how you fight, and your preffered style would match the weapon you like best

this is exactly what i was trying to say. just that we need more variety to make combat more interesting. i would also like a variety of archery equipment as i am an archer in most games (or a battlemage, but that is unfortunately not in this mod) so i was hoping for a bit of variety for us who prefer archery, 3 different types of bows and a crossbow. so yeah variety is all this topic is about, making combat more interesting. oh and to Roark92, i understand what you are getting at but i have pretty much every type of sword on the planet IRl and i can tell you a Katana is much different than a typical double sided sword. seeing as how we are limited to one handed i tried to refrain from listing two handed weapons. there are plenty of weapons that deserve as much respect as everything else but the Katana is easily implemented compared to them and is iconic, that is why i listed it, in the end it is up to you guys and Duncan to figure out what you want most. i just started the topic to get us thinking about it because Dunc is working on the new damage and armor systems.

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what i'd like to see is the mining fatigue system being applied to alter the swing speed of weaponry (which i hope is possible).

in terms of weaponry, i'd like to see a bit more ranged variety (slings anyone? they were a major weapon until bows came along) and for gods sake be the first people to have a game with an effective spear/polearm combat system!

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A visible difference other than colour would be cool for swords and maces, just as with armour but thats more of a texture issue, a claymore texture for high-end swords and a short-sword texture for low-end swords rather than you just looking at the colour and seeing a bright blue sword and running for your life. (i secretly despise the fact that high end weaponry and armour turns you into a power ranger)

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