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Copper

The "Why Can't I...?" Thread

36 posts in this topic

Alright folks, this is a brainstorming thread disguised as a little game.

 

The idea is simple: you know those moments when you are faced with a situation in which you take the most logical action only to find out that it doesn't work? Be it due to oversight or balancing or any reason, this sometimes leads to immersion-breaking.

 

So, I propose this thread become the place to write about it so that a developer or add-on maker or somebody can fix it.

 

Let's keep it short and to the point though - objective issues with objective solutions. I'll start with a few, you guys follow suit:

 

- Why Can't I... drink water from a water bucket?

 

I just went down to the river and forgot to fill my jug. Now I have to go back, even though I'm carrying 4 buckets of water!

 

- Why Can't I... use sticks to fuel a firepit?

 

It is made of wood after all. Sure, each one will burn for a very short time, but I have a ton of them!

 

- Why Can't I... throw rocks at those zombies?

 

There's a zombie trying to eat me, and I happen to have 10 big rocks in my pocket and a good throwing arm!

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Why cant I...eat mushrooms ?

IRL many people swear they are a good food and when your just starting anything you can get can be needful.

 

Why cant I...use a sword to cut grass and get straw?

Straw is dried grass cut with a cutting edge (scythe/dagger - so why not also a sword?

 

Why cant I...eat raw meat?

After slaughtering a pig we cant wolf down its meat to avoid starving without first going home or creating a firepit and cooking it.

 

Why cant I...use water to cool metals down?

I should be able to stand in water with or throw into the water, metals ingots and stuff to cool them down so they can be taken out of molds and stacked.

 

Why cant I....use other grains to lead animals into my storage pen?

The idea is 'here is something you want to eat so follow me and you might get to eat it' yet we can breed them with other grains.

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Why cant I...use water to cool metals down?

I should be able to stand in water with or throw into the water, metals ingots and stuff to cool them down so they can be taken out of molds and stacked.

Actually, you can. In water-filled barrel. But it takes whole barrel of water to cool down something from white heat to nothing. So it is not really practical.

 

 

Why cant I...eat raw meat?

After slaughtering a pig we cant wolf down its meat to avoid starving without first going home or creating a firepit and cooking it.

Because it is not : tasty, easy, efficient and safe. It is said humans evolved big brains because they figured out how to cook meat. Which made it much easier to eat, efficient to digest and safer thanks to reduced bacteria/diseases. So even if you could, it would be huge waste to eat it raw.

 

Why cant I...fill jug from water barrel?

Same thing as Copper said.

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Because it is not : tasty, easy, efficient and safe. It is said humans evolved big brains because they figured out how to cook meat. Which made it much easier to eat, efficient to digest and safer thanks to reduced bacteria/diseases. So even if you could, it would be huge waste to eat it raw.

 

 

In times of desperation raw meat is better than no meat at all, some people lost in the wilderness trying to survive have been known to subside on raw eggs, songbirds and small mammals because they didn't know how to or couldn't light a fire (or were just overcome by hunger). Raw meat digests surprisingly well. However in TFC it could carry the risk of poison and hunger status as well as refilling hunger much less than it would have cooked. So it's a gamble but one worth taking when faced with death by starvation.

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Why cant I...eat mushrooms ?

IRL many people swear they are a good food and when your just starting anything you can get can be needful.

 

Because mushrooms are considered a block and not an item. Minecraft is weird like that. Although, using mushrooms as an ingredient in meals is implemented for B78

 

Why cant I...use a sword to cut grass and get straw?

Straw is dried grass cut with a cutting edge (scythe/dagger - so why not also a sword?

 

Balancing reasons. If your sword can do the same thing as a scythe, why make the scythe?

 

Why cant I...eat raw meat?

After slaughtering a pig we cant wolf down its meat to avoid starving without first going home or creating a firepit and cooking it.

 

Because TFC overhauled the way hunger is handled, and getting food poisoning would be a mess to code.

 

Why cant I...use water to cool metals down?

I should be able to stand in water with or throw into the water, metals ingots and stuff to cool them down so they can be taken out of molds and stacked.

 

As euphoric said, you can. Place the ingot in a barrel of water. The ingot will cool and the water will evaporate.

 

Why cant I....use other grains to lead animals into my storage pen?

The idea is 'here is something you want to eat so follow me and you might get to eat it' yet we can breed them with other grains.

 

This is another instance of Minecraft is dumb. Only one item can be coded to lure animals with.

 

 

Why cant I...fill jug from water barrel?

Same thing as Copper said.

 

You can actually. Same goes for bottles.

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Ty for the responses

 

Balancing reasons. If your sword can do the same thing as a scythe, why make the scythe?

Because it will wear out my sword and I will have nothing I can use to kill the nasties? Also see my thread in suggestions titled "Scythe work"

 

 

Euphoric, on 28 Oct 2013 - 6:01 PM, said:Posted Image

Why cant I...fill jug from water barrel?

Same thing as Copper said.

 

You can actually. Same goes for bottles.

I cannot see this question listed anywhere before Euphorics post.

I believe the original question was Why cant I...drink from a water bucket

If I had to guess the answer I would say that a water bucket holds 2xthe volume of water of a jug and code is not in place to deal with miliBucket amounts of liquid like some other mods use so one cannot have a 'half  full' bucket of water after filling a jug from it.

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I cannot see this question listed anywhere before Euphorics post.

I believe the original question was Why cant I...drink from a water bucket

If I had to guess the answer I would say that a water bucket holds 2xthe volume of water of a jug and code is not in place to deal with miliBucket amounts of liquid like some other mods use so one cannot have a 'half  full' bucket of water after filling a jug from it.

 

That's because Euphoric asked it after quoting other people... Try scrolling down to the bottom of the page, clicking Change Theme, and switching it to TFCraft for easier reading of where quotes start and stop.

 

http://terrafirmacraft.com/wiki/Barrel#Water

 

Shows that you can fill jugs and bottles in a water barrel.

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Why cant I...carve wood?

Carving wood can solve the whole stick debate about whether they are branches or twigs. Properly carved scythe and tool handles, in addition to sword hilts and arrow shafts could add an element of durability like with smithing, with better carved handles giving better durability.

Why cant I... hunt for fish ?

Bowfishing and spearfishing are done in real life. All that's needed are some 3D models of fish mobs.

Why can I...fish without bait?

What fish is dumb enough to bite string? digging up some worms or using some scraps of that cow you butchered yesterday would give fish something to bite.

 

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-Why can't I.... clip sheep wool without iron?

People have been herding and shearing sheep since long before the iron age.  All over in the Bronze Age, in the Middle East in the Neolithic.  Possibly even in Europe towards the end of the era.  Really, all you need is a sharp blade (knife, razor) and a way to hold the animal still enough.  Tie it up with a lead and use a knife?

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-Why can't I.... clip sheep wool without iron?

People have been herding and shearing sheep since long before the iron age.  All over in the Bronze Age, in the Middle East in the Neolithic.  Possibly even in Europe towards the end of the era.  Really, all you need is a sharp blade (knife, razor) and a way to hold the animal still enough.  Tie it up with a lead and use a knife?

 

You can shear sheep with any knife, including stone.

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You can shear sheep with any knife, including stone.

 

You CAN? .... how did I miss this? (aaaaand now  I feel dumb.  'scuse me, have some woolies to go shear...)

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Why can't I... fishing without metal?

To create a fishing rod i have to create a crafting table. To create a CT i have to saw the log to get planks. To saw the log i have to get at least 10 bits of copper or tetrahedrite, dig for clay, chop trees for log.

 

IRL we need to get long stick, get long lace and tie the bone hook. That's enough. Yes, this fishing rod is fragile, but it can save the character's life.

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Why cant I....use other grains to lead animals into my storage pen?

The idea is 'here is something you want to eat so follow me and you might get to eat it' yet we can breed them with other grains.

 

This is another instance of Minecraft is dumb. Only one item can be coded to lure animals with.

 

Here is a solution.

 

Create an item called 'animal lure' or 'grain bag' that looks a bit like a bag of grain or something. 

Make it craftable from all grain types.

Make it lure animals.

???

Profit

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Why cant I....use other grains to lead animals into my storage pen?

The idea is 'here is something you want to eat so follow me and you might get to eat it' yet we can breed them with other grains.

 

This is another instance of Minecraft is dumb. Only one item can be coded to lure animals with.

 

Here is a solution.

 

Create an item called 'animal lure' or 'grain bag' that looks a bit like a bag of grain or something. 

Make it craftable from all grain types.

Make it lure animals.

???

Profit

 

This here. Make it happen.

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Why can't I.....get venison from deer?

Seems only logical that if a pig drops pork, a cow drops steak, a sheep drops mutton, and a chicken drops chicken that I should be able to slaughter a deer and get some venison off of it. As of now it's only use is for hide and bones.

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Why can't I.....get venison from deer?

Seems only logical that if a pig drops pork, a cow drops steak, a sheep drops mutton, and a chicken drops chicken that I should be able to slaughter a deer and get some venison off of it. As of now it's only use is for hide and bones.

 

Implemented in Build 78, just be patient.. mobs in general are still being written.

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Why can't I... Create Hay bales to store straw?

 

We can store logs in a log pile, so why can't we store straw in a hay bale? It's already possible to "store" straw by sticking a clay or ceramic object on the ground and piling up straw around it, so why can't we do something similar without needing to put something on the ground first?

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Why can't I... Create Hay bales to store straw?

 

We can store logs in a log pile, so why can't we store straw in a hay bale? It's already possible to "store" straw by sticking a clay or ceramic object on the ground and piling up straw around it, so why can't we do something similar without needing to put something on the ground first?

 

Technically you already can with thatch.. you just can't un-store it.

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That's not what I meant...

 

In my opinion, Straw is one of the most useful and common materials in the game, but storing it en-masse is tricky and resource intensive. The earliest you can store it is via ceramic pots, which can store four stacks of 64. But that takes up an entire pot which could be used for better things. By giving us hay bales, we can store large quantities of Straw in a more resource efficient manner.

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Why can't I shift right click with a bucket of milk in hand, to add more to a barrel of milk?

 

I think they just missed it. 

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Why cant I place rocks on the ground?

One of the easiest way to mark directions/areas/etc is to place stones. In fact, placing stones in certain formations is a widely-used way of marking your way, with formations for turn right/left, stop, go ahead, danger, safe, etc. Why cant we place stone on the ground and in piles to mark our way?

 

why can I support dirt with thatch?

Thatch is make of straw, and not very sturdy, so why on earth can it support a 1m block of dirt?

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Why cant I place rocks on the ground?

One of the easiest way to mark directions/areas/etc is to place stones. In fact, placing stones in certain formations is a widely-used way of marking your way, with formations for turn right/left, stop, go ahead, danger, safe, etc. Why cant we place stone on the ground and in piles to mark our way?

 

why can I support dirt with thatch?

Thatch is make of straw, and not very sturdy, so why on earth can it support a 1m block of dirt?

 

The thing about coding is that you often look at how something has to behave. You decide under what conditions it should behave a certain way and try to identify which cases are irrelevant to simplify the problem. For example: realistically, rocks picked up off the ground would only drop ore if they were ore, instead of scanning for ore when broken and deciding whether they should drop ore; the rocks would know from the start. However, because they can't be placed back on the ground, we can say that the rocks resolve their drop when broken. While that scenario is different than how real rocks would behave, they behave the same way for the specific situations which can occur in the game. If they had to remember if they were a placed stone or a generated stone, they'd have to store more data besides just the regular rock type (blocks have a very limited range of memory, so you really don't want to be storing too much data in them).

 

 

Basically, we smudge the definition of certain objects to simplify their behaviours.

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The thing about coding is that you often look at how something has to behave. You decide under what conditions it should behave a certain way and try to identify which cases are irrelevant to simplify the problem. For example: realistically, rocks picked up off the ground would only drop ore if they were ore, instead of scanning for ore when broken and deciding whether they should drop ore; the rocks would know from the start. However, because they can't be placed back on the ground, we can say that the rocks resolve their drop when broken. While that scenario is different than how real rocks would behave, they behave the same way for the specific situations which can occur in the game. If they had to remember if they were a placed stone or a generated stone, they'd have to store more data besides just the regular rock type (blocks have a very limited range of memory, so you really don't want to be storing too much data in them).

 

 

Basically, we smudge the definition of certain objects to simplify their behaviours.

You should cut and paste this into every post about realism vs believability vs coding reality.

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Why cant I...eat mushrooms ?

IRL many people swear they are a good food and when your just starting anything you can get can be needful.

 

Why cant I...use a sword to cut grass and get straw?

Straw is dried grass cut with a cutting edge (scythe/dagger - so why not also a sword?

 

Why cant I...eat raw meat?

After slaughtering a pig we cant wolf down its meat to avoid starving without first going home or creating a firepit and cooking it.

 

Why cant I...use water to cool metals down?

I should be able to stand in water with or throw into the water, metals ingots and stuff to cool them down so they can be taken out of molds and stacked.

 

Why cant I....use other grains to lead animals into my storage pen?

The idea is 'here is something you want to eat so follow me and you might get to eat it' yet we can breed them with other grains.

You can cool ingots in water barrels :D

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