Implementing Colored Glass, Stained Glass, and Glassblowing!

[jake_the_odd 14]

Alrighty, what I am suggesting is that we get colored glass, but not in the way that we have it in vanilla, where you surround a dye with glass blocks.

 

No, what I am suggesting is glassblowing, a more immersive and... interesting way to make more creations in TFC.

 

As an FYI, this suggestion is made with the intention to use current gameplay elements while making it more believable!

 

In order to make basic, clear glass, you'd now need a tuyere of any metal type, sand and flux in a ceramic vessel, a pit kiln, lead, and a forge. First, you'd bake the vessel with the sand and flux in it to make your molten glass. Then, you'd put the vessel and the tuyere into the crafting interface to get a "tuyere w/ molten glass," which is still hot and you'd need to spin and blow into the pipe to shape the glass into a disk. If you cannot shape the glass once you put it onto the tuyere, you can use a forge to reheat the item, but be careful, for if you heat it too much you will lose the glass and only have a hot pipe left.

 

When you are making the disk, the process would be very much like smithing, where the red "hit" buttons would be replaced with "spinning" and the green "relax" buttons would be replaced with "blowing." Since you will only have one real method of it, the recipes for the glass will have to be randomized to reduce the monotony of making glass.

 

Once the glass is made into a disk, you will get your tuyere back with a small amount of damage done to it along with a disk of glass. Stop! Hammer-time! You then take the disk and a hammer into the crafting UI and smash the disk to get glass fragments. To make a block of glass, you take 8 fragments and surround a molten, unshaped lead ingot to make 10 blocks of clear glass.

 

If you wish to have a bit of color in your glass, you simply put the color dye into the ceramic vessel before you melt it.

 

If you wish to make window panes, simply use the vanilla recipe to make them, but you will get 6 panes instead of the vanilla amount.

 

Now, onto my main reason for this suggestion, making stained glass!

 

To start, simply place a pane so that it isn't a plus-block-thing (place it between blocks/other panes!) then right-click it with a chisel to open up an 8X8 grid interface. To use it, simply place glass fragments into each box to create your stained glass window, but EVERY box has to have a glass fragment in it, or else you'll destroy the pane, getting back only fragments and the taste of your own tears. Once you have made the pattern you want to be the pane, exit the interface and right-click the pane with a molten, unshaped lead ingot to finish it up! Like sculpting, you can use blueprints with it so long as you have the items necessary, and it will work like sculpting as well, so know where you had the pane face!
 

 

I tried to make this suggestion as immersive and easily stitched in as possible, as well as making a use for lead so y'all can empty your waste-chests of one metal. I thank y'all for reading this and I do hope that you all have a fantastic day/pleasant sleep!

 

For those curious about how you'd make the dyes as they aren't in TFC currently, we'd make dyes using similar processes that were used for making the colors for stained glass IE sulfur for yellow, copper for red, etc mixed in a slurry using the crucible.

Edited 1 Jul 2014 by jake_the_odd

[Rev 11]

_{making glass by sticking fragments onto molten lead isn't very believable to me.... :/but  I don't know.  I know nothing of glass blowing..}

[Tsuarok 47]

This is an amazing idea, though I do have one caveat.  I believe colored glass was made by doping the glass with small amounts of metals, for example, gold for red, cobalt for blue, etc.  I'd prefer something like this over dyes.  

 

But that's kinda beside the point; I love the idea of a more realistic (and delayed) glass crafting system, and the stained glass idea is simply incredible.

[Guest Elagn]

I like this idea and it is far more realistic than simply cooking sand for a long time to get a block of glass. You should, however, be able to blow things other than the disc, like blowing glass bottles or such. Stained glass could be cool and should or should not be able to be blown into objects. If it could, that would be awesome but also a lot of work to code. Also, in TFC, dyes ARE small, ground-up, amounts of metals or minerals.

[Tsuarok 47]

I like this idea and it is far more realistic than simply cooking sand for a long time to get a block of glass. You should, however, be able to blow things other than the disc, like blowing glass bottles or such. Stained glass could be cool and should or should not be able to be blown into objects. If it could, that would be awesome but also a lot of work to code. Also, in TFC, dyes ARE small, ground-up, amounts of metals or minerals.

Oh yeah, it's been forever since I've made dyes in TFC... I'd forgotten.  Well then, the original idea is perfect!

[Moress 27]

I love this idea, I've played TFC twice now, and I would love to see more inter-active processes like blacksmithing is.

[PaoloEmilio 53]

Hello Jake! Long time no see

 

Well, I like your idea of glassworking, and I think a new method of working glass should be implemented in TFC. But I don't get the part of the lead ingot to make glass blocks.

[AllenWL 186]

Hello Jake! Long time no see

 

Well, I like your idea of glassworking, and I think a new method of working glass should be implemented in TFC. But I don't get the part of the lead ingot to make glass blocks.

 

Glass isn't 100% sand.You add different things for different glasses.

soda-lime glass is a common type of glass, made with soda and lime, lead is used in making glass called lead-oxide glass, or crystal glass(looks pretty )

 

I think instead of the fragment thing, just heat some sand to molten temp, then add in a crucible with some lead/lime/whatever to get molten glass(like alloys), then pour it in a glass mold for glass blocks. Glass bottles should be made via blowing. Glass cups, jugs, etc could be added for more water/alcohol storage

[Tsuarok 47]

I think the lead was for a frame for the window pane, not to actually mix into the glass.

[Kazahied 42]

I think the lead was for a frame for the window pane, not to actually mix into the glass.

In lead crystal, small amounts of lead are added to molten glass to make it stronger and clearer.A "glass" wine glass makes a pinging sound a "leaded crystal" wine glass sounds like a freaking bell

 

 

 

leaded crystal is also surprisingly easy to work, being many times easier to grind and carve vs standard glass

[Tsuarok 47]

In lead crystal, small amounts of lead are added to molten glass to make it stronger and clearer.A "glass" wine glass makes a pinging sound a "leaded crystal" wine glass sounds like a freaking bell

 

 

 

leaded crystal is also surprisingly easy to work, being many times easier to grind and carve vs standard glass

Cool. 

 

But I still think Jake was thinking about a lead frame for the stained glass.

[jake_the_odd 14]

Glass isn't 100% sand.You add different things for different glasses.

soda-lime glass is a common type of glass, made with soda and lime, lead is used in making glass called lead-oxide glass, or crystal glass(looks pretty )

 

I think instead of the fragment thing, just heat some sand to molten temp, then add in a crucible with some lead/lime/whatever to get molten glass(like alloys), then pour it in a glass mold for glass blocks. Glass bottles should be made via blowing. Glass cups, jugs, etc could be added for more water/alcohol storage

I didn't want it to get too complex, when I was thinking of this on my "Ivory Throne of Ascension" I had originally intended this to be for making stained glass windows. That and I didn't expect this to cause a small explosion. Btw, yes the lead is for the framework of the window panes/blocks, my mother makes stained glass as a hobby and I got to help her make some patterns a while back as a gift to my aunt.

 

As for the crucible mixing, I didn't want to have the glass-making be too far away from players but it could work in place of the vessel if you don't have any nearby. The making of the cups and jugs and such would actually be pretty cool to add in, especially if they put wine into the game as well, mainly because I want to sip on a chalice of wine next to my fireplace in my single-player world.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

Why has this thread not seen light of day since January?I know glass has been posted before, but this is already an established thread by this point, and it's a GOOD one!

I love the idea for the stained glass murals, but I agree with Allen about making lead crystal glass for most wares - it's just easier to shape

 

For the actual blowing... I was really thinking of having a sort of 'minigame' much like a more complicated knapping process - I'm not quite sure of the details though. Perhaps you have 4 different 'sides' you have to get into the proper shape, clicking tabs on the sides of the gui to 'turn' the molten glass, which will slowly deform on the 'bottom' side until the blob hardens and cools - glass that hardens in the right shape on all 4 sides will become the item, and any mistakes give you a re-meltable 'glass lump', I suppose.

 

Anyone care to help me out on this?

[Felipe James 0]

glassblowing exist since ancient egypt (for who don't know if it's possible) i like it. better than just cook.

[Necoxus 54]

I think glass could be implemented in TFC a bit differently and this sounds like a cool way to do it(I've seen glassblowers in person), I think blowing a disk isn't fair to minecraft, most things in minecraft are square, so maybe you make the regular glass block with the tuyere. Then if you want to dye it, u smash with the hammer in your crafting window, and maybe u can stain the shards by themselves so you can place them in formations inside the crafting window to form different designs in the glass. That could give you a Stained glass assembly that can be smelted into the stained glass block.

[AllenWL 186]

Why has this thread not seen light of day since January?

I didn't have anything more to add, because I couldn't think of anything to argue or improve, and I try to avoid posts that only say 'great idea'.

So yea, that's why I left, don't know about anyone else though.

 

 

For the actual blowing... I was really thinking of having a sort of 'minigame' much like a more complicated knapping process - I'm not quite sure of the details though. Perhaps you have 4 different 'sides' you have to get into the proper shape, clicking tabs on the sides of the gui to 'turn' the molten glass, which will slowly deform on the 'bottom' side until the blob hardens and cools - glass that hardens in the right shape on all 4 sides will become the item, and any mistakes give you a re-meltable 'glass lump', I suppose.

 

Anyone care to help me out on this?

I think there should be two ways to make glass, one using molds and poring(glass melted in vessels or crucibles), a easy quick way, but much limited(say, only jugs can be made or something)

 

For the other method, I'm thinking of a glassblowing/making stand/furnace/whatever you call that which would pretty much be a anvil for glass, and made with say, any metal, and possibly need fuel to work the glass.

 

or, a knapping/molding/leathercutting interface.

 

To work on your idea, I think if we had a interface where we can see the blob of glass, and (lots of)buttons.

Like 4 'press' buttons on four sides that flatten the side it's on, a 2 'blow' buttons, one that make the blob longer and one that makes it wider, and a 'mold' button that lets you cut bits off the blob

 

Kinda scatterbrained,  but [hopefully] you get the idea

[Necoxus 54]

Why has this thread not seen light of day since January?I know glass has been posted before, but this is already an established thread by this point, and it's a GOOD one!

I love the idea for the stained glass murals, but I agree with Allen about making lead crystal glass for most wares - it's just easier to shape

 

For the actual blowing... I was really thinking of having a sort of 'minigame' much like a more complicated knapping process - I'm not quite sure of the details though. Perhaps you have 4 different 'sides' you have to get into the proper shape, clicking tabs on the sides of the gui to 'turn' the molten glass, which will slowly deform on the 'bottom' side until the blob hardens and cools - glass that hardens in the right shape on all 4 sides will become the item, and any mistakes give you a re-meltable 'glass lump', I suppose.

 

Anyone care to help me out on this?

 

I think your right about a minigame, I think we don't need a new furnace or anything for glass we could just heat it up a tuyere (sand inside) in the forge, then right click with the tuyere in you hand(with Liquid Glass) and you have a new advanced knapping interface. Maybe while your "Blowing" the glass there is a slot to input dyes to stain it.

[TonyLiberatto 364]

I love the idea of having stained glass. But glass panels should be molded not blow.

So while the new blowing glass interface system sounds cool I don't want to have to use it for my simple glass panels or blocks.

I think  in the old times glass for windows was molded.

Maybe we can have 2 different molds one for glass blocks and one for glass panels.

For game-play purposes mixing dye with sand before melting should give the color of the glass unless we can have 16 different color metals to add to the sand.

For cups and bottles is where blowing comes in action. 

[Tsuarok 47]

So, I have some personal experience with glassblowing, the more traditional, non-pyrex way. As a starting point I'll just describe the RL process, and then add some thoughts on how it could be translated to TFC.

 

So, first, you take a whole bunch of starting material (for TFC, sand is fine), and heat it up in a crucible.  You dip your blowpipe into the molten glass, and, using a wet cloth, you shape it with your hands.  When it cools down too much, you stick it back in the furnace to reheat it.  If it is to be a vessel, you blow through the tube to create the hollow.  If you want colors, you dab it in colored powders and then reheat it to integrate the colors.  If working on a larger piece, you need to gather the glass on the blowpipe in stages, allowing each stage to cool slightly before adding more.  After you've achieved the shape and color that you want, you allow it to cool just enough to be solid, then score the glass near the blowpipe with a file and sort of knock it off.  It then needs to go into a kiln for a few hours to slowly bring the temperature down, because if allowed to cool too quickly, it will shatter.

 

There are other tools and tricks to get shapes or effects that you want, but that is more or less it.

 

So, how to implement something like this in TFC?

 

I'd suggest, heat up the sand in a crucible, ready when white hot.  Place your blowpipe (tuyere maybe?) in the output slot to affix the glass to the end.  Removing the tuyere opens up the glassblowing interface, where you have anvil-like recipes for various products, with slots for dyes (like the flux slot).  Work should need to be fairly fast, because the working temperature range is pretty narrow.  

 

If it cools down a bit too much, place it in a lit forge to bring the temperature back up and reset the work you've done (not realistic, but easier to code I think).  If allowed to cool a lot, the work is lost.  It could either disappear, or leave something that could be put back in the crucible. (no need to worry about dyes, IRL these get burned off in the crucibles).  

 

The finished work would need to be run through a kiln.  Preferably, we'd have the more permanent advanced kiln to do this in, but if not, for the purpose of the game, the pit kiln would be fine.  Just place them in like pottery and go.  If you wait too long to light it, it disappears.

 

For stained glass, I'd suggest we break colored glass panes and create our masterpieces with lead in a 16x16 grid (different colors would have lead between, while the same colors would not).

 

-Tsuarok

[Tsuarok 47]

I love the idea of having stained glass. But glass panels should be molded not blow.

So while the new blowing glass interface system sounds cool I don't want to have to use it for my simple glass panels or blocks.

I think  in the old times glass for windows was molded.

Maybe we can have 2 different molds one for glass blocks and one for glass panels.

For game-play purposes mixing dye with sand before melting should give the color of the glass unless we can have 16 different color metals to add to the sand.

For cups and bottles is where blowing comes in action. 

Historically, a blob of glass was spun very quickly to create a circular pane, which was then cut into it's square shape.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

So, I have some personal experience with glassblowing, the more traditional, non-pyrex way. As a starting point I'll just describe the RL process, and then add some thoughts on how it could be translated to TFC.

 

So, first, you take a whole bunch of starting material (for TFC, sand is fine), and heat it up in a crucible.  You dip your blowpipe into the molten glass, and, using a wet cloth, you shape it with your hands.  When it cools down too much, you stick it back in the furnace to reheat it.  If it is to be a vessel, you blow through the tube to create the hollow.  If you want colors, you dab it in colored powders and then reheat it to integrate the colors.  If working on a larger piece, you need to gather the glass on the blowpipe in stages, allowing each stage to cool slightly before adding more.  After you've achieved the shape and color that you want, you allow it to cool just enough to be solid, then score the glass near the blowpipe with a file and sort of knock it off.  It then needs to go into a kiln for a few hours to slowly bring the temperature down, because if allowed to cool too quickly, it will shatter.

 

There are other tools and tricks to get shapes or effects that you want, but that is more or less it.

 

So, how to implement something like this in TFC?

 

I'd suggest, heat up the sand in a crucible, ready when white hot.  Place your blowpipe (tuyere maybe?) in the output slot to affix the glass to the end.  Removing the tuyere opens up the glassblowing interface, where you have anvil-like recipes for various products, with slots for dyes (like the flux slot).  Work should need to be fairly fast, because the working temperature range is pretty narrow.  

 

If it cools down a bit too much, place it in a lit forge to bring the temperature back up and reset the work you've done (not realistic, but easier to code I think).  If allowed to cool a lot, the work is lost.  It could either disappear, or leave something that could be put back in the crucible. (no need to worry about dyes, IRL these get burned off in the crucibles).  

 

The finished work would need to be run through a kiln.  Preferably, we'd have the more permanent advanced kiln to do this in, but if not, for the purpose of the game, the pit kiln would be fine.  Just place them in like pottery and go.  If you wait too long to light it, it disappears.

 

For stained glass, I'd suggest we break colored glass panes and create our masterpieces with lead in a 16x16 grid (different colors would have lead between, while the same colors would not).

 

-Tsuarok

 

This is the exact post I was hoping to see in here. Dunk, what word from the riddermark?

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Looked into stained glass once. The reason it wasn't implemented sooner is that I forced myself to stick to traditional / historical chemical compositions for stained glass (not dye based, but the chemical component such as gold for red glass).

 

TFC just didn't have the mineral base for a wide enough variety of colours and/or the ones that could be manufactured from existing chemicals involved complicated processes.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

Looked into stained glass once. The reason it wasn't implemented sooner is that I forced myself to stick to traditional / historical chemical compositions for stained glass (not dye based, but the chemical component such as gold for red glass).

 

TFC just didn't have the mineral base for a wide enough variety of colours and/or the ones that could be manufactured from existing chemicals involved complicated processes.

 

Hoooooowever, we have a few more minerals now, and we've already done a few less-than-100%-accurate-for-gameplay-reasons things... since it's a purely aesthetic change, I don't see why this shouldn't be in

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Because dammit, I'm going to teach you how to make coloured glass! One of my pet peeves with minecraft was that things were crafted or existed based on the conceptual notion of a thing, rather than what it is itself, for example crafting tools was drawing the tool in a 3x3 grid, or with items that represent something, such as dyes just representing a colour like blue, and then anything blue that you want just needs that dye. TFC already does away with that, we make you work metal on an anvil into the shape that you want, so i see no reason to fall back on a vanilla mechanic just because it's easy.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

Because dammit, I'm going to teach you how to make coloured glass! One of my pet peeves with minecraft was that things were crafted or existed based on the conceptual notion of a thing, rather than what it is itself, for example crafting tools was drawing the tool in a 3x3 grid, or with items that represent something, such as dyes just representing a colour like blue, and then anything blue that you want just needs that dye. TFC already does away with that, we make you work metal on an anvil into the shape that you want, so i see no reason to fall back on a vanilla mechanic just because it's easy.

 

...Vanilla? Dude have you SEEN this thread? lol

It's all about new GUIs and joining shattered glass chips with molten lead. Where is the vanilla in this? This is like some fuckin... acai berry puree with cloudberry extract made into a compote to top ostrich meat stuff right here. This shit is exotic