Content: Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Background: Slate Blackcurrant Watermelon Strawberry Orange Banana Apple Emerald Chocolate Marble
Pattern: Blank Waves Notes Sharp Wood Rockface Leather Honey Vertical Triangles
Welcome to TerraFirmaCraft Forums

Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to contribute to this site by submitting your own content or replying to existing content. You'll be able to customize your profile, receive reputation points as a reward for submitting content, while also communicating with other members via your own private inbox, plus much more! This message will be removed once you have signed in.

  • Announcements

    • Dries007

      ATTENTION Forum Database Breach   03/04/2019

      There has been a breach of our database. Please make sure you change your password (use a password manager, like Lastpass).
      If you used this password anywhere else, change that too! The passwords themselves are stored hashed, but may old accounts still had old, insecure (by today's standards) hashes from back when they where created. This means they can be "cracked" more easily. Other leaked information includes: email, IP, account name.
      I'm trying my best to find out more and keep everyone up to date. Discord (http://invite.gg/TerraFirmaCraft) is the best option for up to date news and questions. I'm sorry for this, but the damage has been done. All I can do is try to make sure it doesn't happen again.
    • Claycorp

      This forum is now READ ONLY!   01/20/2020

      As of this post and forever into the future this forum has been put into READ ONLY MODE. There will be no new posts! A replacement is coming SoonTM . If you wish to stay up-to-date on whats going on or post your content. Please use the Discord or Sub-Reddit until the new forums are running.

      Any questions or comments can be directed to Claycorp on either platform.
chepelink

Question about food preservation and beyond

40 posts in this topic

I read that there are going to be a way to preserve food. I have some question and some thoughts.

1. Is preserved food be like slated meat (half the decay rate) or are you going to give us free days/months of zero decay and after that the decay normally?

2. At what 'era' are you going to make available this methods?

3. Are you going to reduce the weight of preserved food because of preservation method (like dry or smoke)?

4. Do you plan to have some food (aside from milk, since cheese is a way of preserving milk) to be treated or all food can be treated for preservation?

 

I asked these because I feel that the food decay as it is it too slow in the inventory and too fast in the chest/jar (or it seems as this). If you answer 1) as free days/months you can actually put more pressure to food preservation making the decay rate faster (IRL raw meat start to stink in a warm/hot day in few hours). That also mean that the sooner you got your preservation tools the better, since you can now actually store food in your chest/jar for days/months (as IRL) and some techniques are from the stone age (dry food and smoke meat). I think that free days/months would be better  in single player since you can have a much more realistic experience disabling the food protection option (when the chunk is loaded it just do a math operation to get how many days you left from food/chunk and reduce the days accordingly). In multiplayer games either options are hard to control since the world is "always on" unless you can do two things: store the last log-in and ownership of a preserved food and make it inedible and unable to decay if the player is not online. With that you can give some kind of off-line penalty (e.g., 1 day of food preservation per 5 days of IRL of being off-line) to ensure some kind of realism. 

 

 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Foods decay at the same rate in the inventory vs. in a container as long as they are at the same temperature. Food in a vessel in your inventory decays at the same rate as food just in your inventory. Food in your inventory might decay faster than food in a jar placed on the ground because that jar is at a lower temperature. Vessels do indeed slow food decay by 50%.

 

The way that food decays is that there is an initial 24 hour grace period. After that, the decay is based off of a compounding percentage (so food with 5% decay is slower to rot than food with 50% decay).

 

1. Preserved food will simply decrease the base rate of decay, like how salted meat decays 50% slower than non-salted meat. There will be no extended grace period

2. The 'era' of these methods will be the same as the 'era' of the rest of the age, whatever feels like it is believable and would make sense for somebody to be able to do with the materials around them. It wouldn't make sense for a man carrying around stone rocks as tools to be able to make a modern day freezer to store all their stuff.

3. Reducing the weight on processing probably won't happen just for simplicity sake. Bread doubles in weight as incentive to finish the process, as well as the fact that you can't really eat the other stages unless you put them in a meal. Especially for the case of meat, which is often dropped in pieces of max weight, having that weight decrease after processing would add an annoying step of recombining everything to have as many max size pieces as possible.

4. I don't understand what you are asking. More meat processing will likely happen, as well as maybe pickling.. but Bioxx has said that fruit probably won't be able to be preserved due to the high sugar content and the fact that canning isn't really within the time frame of TFC.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you very much. 

 

It is a shame that there are not going to be an extended grace period, I was thinking that would be great to plan my harvest to have it ready to be processed in fall to last all winter and the first harvest of spring easily. Anyway, that answer my questions.

 

:D

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

More meat processing will likely happen, as well as maybe pickling.. but Bioxx has said that fruit probably won't be able to be preserved due to the high sugar content and the fact that canning isn't really within the time frame of TFC.

 

What about drying fruit? Drying has been a form of preservation for centuries, and would work particularly well for apples, plums and some of the berries, as well as vegetables like garlic and corn. There could be an easier, earlier game method in the open air that results in some loss from wild animals, and a more advanced solar or flame dryer later in the game.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What about drying fruit? Drying has been a form of preservation for centuries, and would work particularly well for apples, plums and some of the berries, as well as vegetables like garlic and corn. There could be an easier, earlier game method in the open air that results in some loss from wild animals, and a more advanced solar or flame dryer later in the game.

 

Exactly, drying fruit is as old as the stone age. What gives?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

fruit probably won't be able to be preserved due to the high sugar content and the fact that canning isn't really within the time frame of TFC.

Other then drying fruit, I thought sugar was supposed to help preserve food? Like, draw out the moisture and everything?

And what about jam? We make jam at home sometimes, and all it takes is just getting some fruits and sugar in a pot then cooking it over flames until it gets jam-like. Isn't that doable in the TFC timeline?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jam has been discussed pretty thoroughly and so far it seems like the Dev. Though drying fruit is a fair thought, it was how Robinson Crusoe preserved the berries he found so that he could have a more well rounded diet year round. I think there should be a drying rack that is either built with planks or another way which could dry fruit and meat (there have been some cool photos and posts about this already).

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought sugar was supposed to help preserve food? Like, draw out the moisture and everything?

 

Sugar does indeed draw out moisture, but unlike salt, it's also an excellent source of calories for bacteria to feed on, so unless the sugar content is so extremely high that bacteria can't live in it, they'll just thrive in it.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kittychanley

"Food in your inventory might decay faster than food in a jar placed on the ground because that jar is at a lower temperature."

 

And just to be clear. Are vessels best way to preserve foods?

Per exemple, a carrot in a chest VS a carrot in a vessel, both in the underground in a hole, no light, same temperature; does the one in the vessel will be preserved longer than the one in the chest?  :)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The older post was incorrect, Bioxx informed me that vessels do indeed slow decay by 50%. I'll go delete that old post.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's pretty good news, although it'll be mostly useful for storing large stacks of cooked food, not raw ingredients.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More meat processing will likely happen, as well as maybe pickling.. but Bioxx has said that fruit probably won't be able to be preserved due to the high sugar content and the fact that canning isn't really within the time frame of TFC.

More ways of preserving meat like jerky or other smoked meats? Like BACON?! :DAlso pickling would be amazing. And canning could be a future add-on. So if vessel decreases food decay by 50% and salting decreases decay by 50% and being in a cold hole in the ground decreases it (idk how much) does that mean salted meat in a vessel in a hole below freezing is never going to decay? Or is there a minimum amount you can decrease the decay to?

The older post was incorrect, Bioxx informed me that vessels do indeed slow decay by 50%. I'll go delete that old post.

Once again, is there a difference between vessels and chests? Or vessels on the ground vs vessels in chests?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So if vessel decreases food decay by 50% and salting decreases decay by 50% and being in a cold hole in the ground decreases it (idk how much) does that mean salted meat in a vessel in a hole below freezing is never going to decay? Or is there a minimum amount you can decrease the decay to?Once again, is there a difference between vessels and chests? Or vessels on the ground vs vessels in chests?

 

Salted cooked meat in a vessel in a hole below freezing temperature still decays, just at a rate that is so incredibly slow that you won't ever notice it. This may seem a bit OP right now, but once body temperature is in place, you won't be able to hang out in that super cold area for very long without proper protection like warm clothing.

 

The only check is if the food is inside of a vessel. It doesn't matter if that vessel is in your inventory, on the ground, or in a chest other than the temperature of that location.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have several questions prompted by this thread:

  • Will underground temperatures simulate real life, in that it gets warmer as you go down?
  • Does a chest count as a vessel, or is the fired clay item "Vessel" the only container with this preservation bonus?
  • Will placed items such as vessels ever receive a non-rotating 3d model?
  • Will vessels ever be accessible directly from the environment, like chests?
  • Will we ever get larger urn-like vessels with increased storage, perhaps even requiring a deeper pit kiln to fire?
  • Can vessels be placed on chiseled blocks? If a single block is 8x8x8, can I carve a 4x1x8 kitchen shelf and still be able to place a vessel on it?
  • If I heat up a cinnamon roll, and place it in a vessel alongside a Klondike Bar, will their respective temperatures be maintained, or will I have a soggy mess by lunch?
  • Will I eat it anyway?
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does a chest count as a vessel, or is the fired clay item "Vessel" the only container with this preservation bonus?

Yes, vessel, the only container with preservation bonus. I think devs what them separate utility; chests for large storage, vessels for preservation foods. ;)

And it's perfect that way.

 

Will vessels ever be accessible directly from the environment, like chests?

could be very cool. Or just a shortcut by putting items in them with right-click, just like barrels :)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • I know that temperature decreases as you get to higher altitudes, but I don't know if the inverse is true. I'd have to ask Dunk because I'm too lazy to dig through the code right now.
  • Only the item called "Ceramic Vessel" has the 50% preservation. However, you can put your food in a ceramic vessel, and then put that vessel inside of a chest.
  • No, because Bioxx said so.
  • Probably not, because the title entity for storing pottery simply has 4 slots to store the vessels in. It would have to be rewritten to a fairly complicated system in order to copy the 16 slots from the 4 vessels into pottery tile entity, and keep that information synced while removing and placing vessels.
  • Large vessels are planned, if you look in the creative menu there is already a placeholder item for them.
  • Vessels cannot be placed inside of the same 1x1 cube that contains a chiseled block. This is for the exact same reason that you cannot place a stone and a wooden half slab in the same block in vanilla Minecraft. However, you are able to place pottery on top of a chiseled block as long as the face that they are sitting on is solid and unchiseled. You cannot place pottery on top of a solid face that was created by plank items though, so you'll have to chisel a plank block if you want wooden shelves.
  • Posted Image
  • The respective temperatures will be maintained, think of each slot as it's own little partitioned area that is surrounded by an insulating vacuum.
  • Yes, because ice cream and a cinnamon roll sounds absolutely delicious, even if the ice cream is melted.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sugar does indeed draw out moisture, but unlike salt, it's also an excellent source of calories for bacteria to feed on, so unless the sugar content is so extremely high that bacteria can't live in it, they'll just thrive in it.

Well, I'm pretty sure that jam has a extremely high sugar content, but I should really stop this.

 

Well, I learned a lot...

So instead of carrying food just in your inventory, it's a lot better to put it in a vessel, then to put it in your inventory.

 

And um I'm kinda confused about this, but does putting food in a hole slow the decay rate?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you put food in a vessel in a hole, and then cover that hole with a block, the decay rate will be slower because the food is being stored in a dark area, and dark areas are colder, and the cold slows decay.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, I get it, putting it in a hole lowers the temperature, which preserves the food.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Huh, creating a dark spot lowers temperature? No wonder temperature is so variable under trees.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They don't really lower it that much, at least nowhere near the seasonal temperature change where the decay slowdown is actually noticeable. There's really no practical point in putting food in dark holes.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From the 78.0 Changelog:

  • Light level now affects temperature. A fully dark area will be 25% cooler than ambient temperature.

So if the ambient temperature is currently 30C, putting it in a dark hole is going to drop it down to 22.5C. That's almost a 10 degree change in temperature, so I would consider it incentive enough to store your food in a dark hole.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Out of curiosity, is there anything implemented or in the works similar to iceboxes? The technology needed for one is extremely minimal, i actually own a functional wooden icebox, they were one of the most common ways of preserving food once transportation such as cars became viable. However, carving ice and carrying it yourself seems plausible, that's how the Vanderbilt's did it at their mansion.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Out of curiosity, is there anything implemented or in the works similar to iceboxes? The technology needed for one is extremely minimal, i actually own a functional wooden icebox, they were one of the most common ways of preserving food once transportation such as cars became viable. However, carving ice and carrying it yourself seems plausible, that's how the Vanderbilt's did it at their mansion.

 

Bioxx has indeed been playing around with the idea of refrigeration/icebox systems. One of the ideas was wrapping ice blocks around their sides in red steel to prevent them from melting, and putting the food on top of that.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites