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HypnoToadTrance

Perhaps Nerf Baby Zombies?

28 posts in this topic

I was playing with a streamer last night. He was killed by a baby zombie, which as you know, do not burn to death in the sun, making them tiny, fast, formidable enemies during the day and night.

 

In addition to the aforementioned traits, baby zombies also have the ability to pick up weapons, which if you'll watch this video, present quite a danger--especially to players who are killed by a baby zombie and are then effectively prevented from retrieving their items by this unstoppable killing machine of a baby.

 

http://www.twitch.tv/selivaria/b/540773862

 

Here is the video from the stream last night. You can see the event and the significant danger it posed at: 02:13:00. After he cuts down that tree, you'll see the horror that ensues.

 

It takes two hits from a weapon-wielding baby zombie to kill a healthy unarmoured player. Their fast speed and small size make this especially more dangerous and on multiplayer where server lag, no matter how low that latency may be, will present added difficulties in anticipating movement and reacting with force.

 

After being killed and revived, the player has half-health. This means that after you are killed once by this super baby, all future attempts to combat or even retrieve your items will mean a one-hit-kill for you.

 

I feel perhaps something could be done about the severe advantage baby zombies have over players?

 

Changing their A.I. to prevent item pickup would be nice. If we were to think realistically (as realistic as a baby zombie is), I think it would be fair enough to say that a baby would lack the physical strength to wield a heavy mace or sword much less attack with it effectively.

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oh gods this

 

Or even just make them burn in the day

 

And before you say anything Dunk, I KNOW that that's Mojang's fuck-up, not yours, and that dicking around in notchcode is implausibly difficult and annoying and work-intensive and you have a real job now... but seriously, those little bastards can make the game nigh-unplayable. This needs to be moved to, like, priority slot 1.

 

I just hope you can overwrite it, and not have to use base edits

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Plus, that baby is near-impossible to see in tall grass, which happens to be everywhere.

Just making them burn in the sun and giving them normal zombie speed would be a godsend.

Or, as a alternative, just don't make baby zombies spawn.

Whichever's easier(I wouldn't know. I don't code)

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oh gods this

 

Or even just make them burn in the day

 

And before you say anything Dunk, I KNOW that that's Mojang's fuck-up, not yours, and that dicking around in notchcode is implausibly difficult and annoying and work-intensive and you have a real job now... but seriously, those little bastards can make the game nigh-unplayable. This needs to be moved to, like, priority slot 1.

 

I just hope you can overwrite it, and not have to use base edits

 

I really enjoy how you worded that, and I agree baby zombies can cause some much trouble its crazy, even in base minecraft they are bad, little things. A nerf would be highly welcomed by almost all players.

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I... Think that baby zombies adds some challenge to TFC combat. Heck, even a copper sword and bow & arrow is enough for me to get on par with my vanilla combat skill. How did you not have a bow? You could literally overcharge the bow (bug) and send a projectile bringing 1500~ damage to everything that lines up in front of you.

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No feathers, no arrows.

And so far, haven't even seen a single pheasant or chicken

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*looks at the video*

 

So basically:

A level 1 player, completely unarmored, with no weapon in their hotbar, walks out in the middle of the night to chop a tree outside of the spawn protection area with monsters easily visible all around the player. The player has a minimap with mob radar installed, on which you can easily see an approaching creeper, which the player completely misses. The player subsequently gets blown up by the creeper and loses 90% of their health. The mob radar also showns the approaching zombie icon, which the player also completely misses. The baby zombie then takes two hits to kill the (level 1, unarmored, down to 10% health) player.

 

Afterwards, the baby zombie proves its meddlesome and difficult nature by being easily killed by the player (now level 0, still unarmored, down to 20% health from the recent death) with just an axe, not even a real weapon.

 

And you ask for baby zombies to get nerfed? Seriously? :huh:

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*looks at the video*

 

So basically:

A level 1 player, completely unarmored, with no weapon in their hotbar, walks out in the middle of the night to chop a tree outside of the spawn protection area with monsters easily visible all around the player. The player has a minimap with mob radar installed, on which you can easily see an approaching creeper, which the player completely misses. The player subsequently gets blown up by the creeper and loses 90% of their health. The mob radar also showns the approaching zombie icon, which the player also completely misses. The baby zombie then takes two hits to kill the (level 1, unarmored, down to 10% health) player.

 

Afterwards, the baby zombie proves its meddlesome and difficult nature by being easily killed by the player (now level 0, still unarmored, down to 20% health from the recent death) with just an axe, not even a real weapon.

 

And you ask for baby zombies to get nerfed? Seriously? :huh:

 

The baby zombie killed all three of us. I went out there, equipped with a bronze mace and sinpodder had a bronze sword. Both of us were killed easily by the zombie. I was at full health, although unarmoured and quickly dispatched within two hits. 

 

The reason he was able to kill the baby with his axe is because both sin and I had managed to get a few hits in before being killed by the baby.

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*looks at the video*

 

So basically:

A level 1 player, completely unarmored, with no weapon in their hotbar, walks out in the middle of the night to chop a tree outside of the spawn protection area with monsters easily visible all around the player. The player has a minimap with mob radar installed, on which you can easily see an approaching creeper, which the player completely misses. The player subsequently gets blown up by the creeper and loses 90% of their health. The mob radar also showns the approaching zombie icon, which the player also completely misses. The baby zombie then takes two hits to kill the (level 1, unarmored, down to 10% health) player.

 

Afterwards, the baby zombie proves its meddlesome and difficult nature by being easily killed by the player (now level 0, still unarmored, down to 20% health from the recent death) with just an axe, not even a real weapon.

 

And you ask for baby zombies to get nerfed? Seriously? :huh:

Exactly this. Just because people are retarded to go outside at night with zero armor and don't pay any attention to their surroundings, doesn't mean the mobs need to be nerfed. If you are so bothered by it, play modded MC, where you can get ultimate armor with jetpacks and 1-hit weapons in 1 hour of gameplay. I'm sure you will love it.

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there is a lot problems caused by baby zombies that should be addressed but they started they didn't want to mess with vanilla code too much. Since we all find them problematic the simplest solution is to remove them. I still think skeletons are worse though

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The baby zombie killed all three of us. I went out there, equipped with a bronze mace and sinpodder had a bronze sword. Both of us were killed easily by the zombie. I was at full health, although unarmoured and quickly dispatched within two hits. 

 

The reason he was able to kill the baby with his axe is because both sin and I had managed to get a few hits in before being killed by the baby.

 

Ah, I see, apologies. The chat messages weren't clear on that one (it just said "player died" instead of "player was killed by baby zombie").

 

Still, it managed to do so only because it picked up a tier 2 mace that selivaria had carried. It could have picked up any of the tools dropped from that death (which was still 100% selivaria's fault), you just got the worst possible random result by pure misfortune. And two hits for full health means you had a fairly low max health number due to lack of a balanced diet. Tier 2 weapon is what, some 225 damage? Unsure if that is modified by difficulty setting. The server seemed to have a very low one, considering it took the baby zombie two hits to remove 10% health from selivaria without a weapon.

 

The problem with nerfing baby zombies is that what killed you here is the tier 2 weapon it carried, not the monster itself. Unless you want to remove the ability to pick up stuff from zombies altogether. At which point they become about as threatening as a wet noodle to anyone with any form of armor (even just leather). Also note: the baby zombie is fully intended to be incredibly dangerous. It spawns very rarely, and should be seen as a literal "mini-boss" mob.

 

There is possibly an issue with mob-wielded weapon damage not scaling with difficulty level if the thing really two-shot you. That in turn would be a good thing to fix/address, because sometimes zombies do spawn with weapons pre-equipped. And if they don't scale with difficulty, that's a bug.

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Ah, I see, apologies. The chat messages weren't clear on that one (it just said "player died" instead of "player was killed by baby zombie").

 

Still, it managed to do so only because it picked up a tier 2 mace that selivaria had carried. It could have picked up any of the tools dropped from that death (which was still 100% selivaria's fault), you just got the worst possible random result by pure misfortune. And two hits for full health means you had a fairly low max health number due to lack of a balanced diet. Tier 2 weapon is what, some 225 damage? Unsure if that is modified by difficulty setting. The server seemed to have a very low one, considering it took the baby zombie two hits to remove 10% health from selivaria without a weapon.

 

The problem with nerfing baby zombies is that what killed you here is the tier 2 weapon it carried, not the monster itself. Unless you want to remove the ability to pick up stuff from zombies altogether. At which point they become about as threatening as a wet noodle to anyone with any form of armor (even just leather). Also note: the baby zombie is fully intended to be incredibly dangerous. It spawns very rarely, and should be seen as a literal "mini-boss" mob.

 

There is possibly an issue with mob-wielded weapon damage not scaling with difficulty level if the thing really two-shot you. That in turn would be a good thing to fix/address, because sometimes zombies do spawn with weapons pre-equipped. And if they don't scale with difficulty, that's a bug. 

They honestly don't even need that much of a nerf. They just need to burn in the day, which they're supposed to do ANYWAY. Mojang straight-up said it's a bug, they just haven't fixed it yet

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I actually never had overly much problems with baby zombies. The only thing that really bothered me is that they don't seem to drop much in terms of items or experience, especially in relation to how superior they are when compared with regular zombies. I play usually at hard or hardcore, rarely wear any decent armor and I also didn't find them as powerful, fast etc however as people claim them to be. Wither skeletons I consider to be far worse adversary.

However, the not-burning-during-the-day bug should be fixed and it does seem a bit weird that such little things have no issues with utilizing regular equipment players may drop. Why I wouldn't want baby zombies to disappear completely, slight reduction in spawn rate, a restriction on using dropped items and activation of susceptibility to the sunlight would be good, if it would be possible without any major issues.

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They honestly don't even need that much of a nerf. They just need to burn in the day, which they're supposed to do ANYWAY. Mojang straight-up said it's a bug, they just haven't fixed it yet

 

I actually never had overly much problems with baby zombies. The only thing that really bothered me is that they don't seem to drop much in terms of items or experience, especially in relation to how superior they are when compared with regular zombies.

 

Both the not burning and the not dropping items and exp are known bugs, that I believe Mojang actually already fixed for 1.7.. so there's nothing that TFC needs to do since 79 is going to be for 1.7 anyways and vanilla has fixed these bugs.

 

Edit: Not dropping items or experience was fixed in 1.7.2. The not burning in sunlight is still listed in Mojang's bug tracker, but the official statement on it is that this is intended behavior, and not a bug: https://bugs.mojang.com/browse/MC-3115

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Still, it managed to do so only because it picked up a tier 2 mace that selivaria had carried. It could have picked up any of the tools dropped from that death (which was still 100% selivaria's fault), you just got the worst possible random result by pure misfortune

Actually.....

zombies pick up what they deem the best weapon/armor.

So no, the zombie picking up that mace as not a random misfortune.

If you look, you'll note that the baby zombie was holding a block of dirt at first.

But it saw the mace, said 'hey, that's a much better weapon than a block of dirt!' and decided to drop the dirt and get the mace.

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-snip-

 

If you read my above post, you would see that baby zombies not dropping anything is a bug. A bug that has been fixed in Minecraft 1.7.2, the version that 79 is already currently being ported to. So the whole argument is moot.

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You... Could pluck feathers from pheasants and chickens. Infinite feathers. Just.. Just get on top of them and make sure they can't reach you. It's that simple. I even killed one with a raspberry bush.

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Kitty, any idea in regards to scaling monster weapon damage with game difficulty? Is this happening/not happening? Is that intended/not intended?

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Kitty, any idea in regards to scaling monster weapon damage with game difficulty? Is this happening/not happening? Is that intended/not intended?

 

As far as I know, the level of difficulty other than peaceful/not peaceful/hardcore means absolutely nothing in TFC. A normal difficulty and a hard difficulty are exactly the same.

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Huh. I did not know that! Interesting.

 

(In my defense, the only time I ever played TFC on anything other than Hardcore difficulty was in a multiplayer game back in B75... :P)

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If you read my above post, you would see that baby zombies not dropping anything is a bug. A bug that has been fixed in Minecraft 1.7.2, the version that 79 is already currently being ported to. So the whole argument is moot.

Which is why I crossed out the entire argument...

But I should have deleted the whole thing, really, so my fault. Sorry

 

 

You... Could pluck feathers from pheasants and chickens. 

I'll do that...... when I find the pheasants and chickens.

 

 

So.... is that a no to the baby zombie nerf?

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The not burning in sunlight is still listed in Mojang's bug tracker, but the official statement on it is that this is intended behavior, and not a bug: https://bugs.mojang.com/browse/MC-3115

 

 

 

Posted Image

 

Since Mojang won't do it, you guys should. Babies not burning is fucking retarded, and incredibly dangerous. It's not believable, and it just doesn't fit.

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Baby zombies are scary, but I like a little fear in my Minecraft.

 

… Babies not burning is fucking retarded, and incredibly dangerous. It's not believable, and it just doesn't fit.

 Baby … zombies … not burning … is "not believable".You, sir, have been playing Minecraft too long. Time to take a little break. : )

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Since Mojang won't do it, you guys should. Babies not burning is fucking retarded, and incredibly dangerous. It's not believable, and it just doesn't fit.

 

Considering that the "monsters" are moving underground anyways.. it's not like any of them are going to burn because they're all going to be running around in caves where there is no sun.

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Baby … zombies … not burning … is "not believable".

Think he meant baby zombies not burning when every other freaking zombie burns, simply because it's a baby is not believable.

 

But I suppose we can make all undead not burn in the sun and since they'll be moving underground anyways, that would work fine I suppose to balancing out baby zombies

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