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kurzninja

Items with building (structure) requirements

27 posts in this topic

Obviously it's possible to have blocks test for certain conditions before they will allowed to be put down, but what are the limits of this? Is there a way to have an object test whether or not it's "inside" or "outside"?

 

My thinking was having certain items like anvils, bloomeries, maybe some kind of "sawmill" machine that can process logs, or any other types of more advanced (relatively speaking :rolleyes: ) technologies have requirements that they be located within a certain type of space. For instance:

 

  • A bloomery should be inside not just the multi-block structure that makes it up, but housed in a larger building of a certain minimum size that must be made out of stone bricks, not wood or thatch because of the type of heat that a bloomery would output.
  • A sawmill machine (making this up here) would have a requirement to have a roof of a particular size and minimum height overhead to work. 
  • An anvil would have to also be around stone blocks (because it's heavy) and not too close to any flammable materials because of the heat of the items being worked on them.

One of my biggest wants in a mod, especially one like TFC, is something that encourages actually building certain structures, maybe even as a requirement for advancement. This, in turn, would actually encourage the development of towns rather than just one little house to sleep in while everything else is done out in the backyard.

 

Is this even possible/feasible? Or does everyone but me think this is a bad idea?

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Feasible, but the internal pathfinding necessary for that amount of detection would lag HORRIBLY, and make multiplayer near impossible.Do remember, this mod is played predominantly on servers where people form towns ANYWAY, and so development follows this. Not to say that developing for SSP is unimportant, and there are plenty of SSP changes I would like to see, but it's simply not a priority unfortunately.

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I'm not a fan of this idea. I think people should have the freedom to design and build their own structures, not slavishly reproduce hard-coded requirements.

 

Most of the illustrations we have of original real-life bloomeries and blast furnaces show them outside anyway. It wasn't until the processes were industrialized that they were incorporated into structures larger than simple sheds for storing ore and fuel.

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I am also not fond of this idea. While I don't mind certain prerequisites enforcing logical design decisions (furnace having access to some sort of chimney/ventilation, charcoal pit needing the opposite) going too far with such would not only stem creativity but severely limit enjoyment as everyone would have to develop certain facilities up to some hard-coded spec.

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-stuff-

 

...Slightly off topic, but I LOVE how that picture blends in like that. Can we do this more often guys? Can this be a thing around here?

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I'd personally prefer that you can place/make structures anywhere, but it can end up harming you(like how a poorly placed pit kiln can burn down your house)

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I'd personally prefer that you can place/make structures anywhere, but it can end up harming you(like how a poorly placed pit kiln can burn down your house)

 

 

Isn't that... already in the game?

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I mean, for forges and fire pits and bloomeries and anvils and whatnot.

Right now, you need a forge to have a 'chimney' to make one, right?

But what If I can make a forge without the 'ventilation', but just have it backfire on me somehow?(say, it make a bunch of smoke that puts out the forge and/or suffocates me/whatever bad things can happen from having a forge with no ventilation).

What if anvils have a chance to fall through blocks like thatch or planks(item) when updated/used/placed?

What if the firepit can light flammable blocks near it on fire, or/and create smoke?

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I mean, for forges and fire pits and bloomeries and anvils and whatnot.

Right now, you need a forge to have a 'chimney' to make one, right?

But what If I can make a forge without the 'ventilation', but just have it backfire on me somehow?(say, it make a bunch of smoke that puts out the forge and/or suffocates me/whatever bad things can happen from having a forge with no ventilation).

What if anvils have a chance to fall through blocks like thatch or planks(item) when updated/used/placed?

What if the firepit can light flammable blocks near it on fire, or/and create smoke?

 

 

ooh, that.. actually gives me an idea...Instead of having the chimney requirements, you could make an upward-flowing 'liquid' block called smoke, that would behave in a manner similar to flux gas from Thaumcraft 4, only it would stack on top of itself and therefore accumulate. It's only texture would be a 'smoke' particle effect, and having it in the same block as your head would start suffocating you exactly the same as water.

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ooh, that.. actually gives me an idea...Instead of having the chimney requirements, you could make an upward-flowing 'liquid' block called smoke, that would behave in a manner similar to flux gas from Thaumcraft 4, only it would stack on top of itself and therefore accumulate. It's only texture would be a 'smoke' particle effect, and having it in the same block as your head would start suffocating you exactly the same as water.

Whoah... awesome O.O

 

Make sure that it doesn't flow right up to the build limit tho, I don't want black puffy beacons coming from my smithy :P

I would suggest that it give a blindness and a slowness effect for 3 seconds or so before you start suffocating though, just as a warning...

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I think he means that when your head is in smoke, you'll get those air bubble things that you get underwater, and take damage when they run out.

Smoke should dissipate over some time, so we don't end up covering the entire sky with gray smoke and ashes like in some places in the industrial age.

 

that aside, I think giving restrictions like those would be better then giving restrictions like 'forge needs to be surrounded by stone and have chimney', or 'pit kiln needs to be in a hole'.

Let them learn not to make a forge without a chimney by suffering from smoky rooms, let them learn to surround a forge with stone by having blocks catch on fire(or burn fuel faster, or don't get as hot, or get destroyed), and let them learn to put a pit kiln in a pit from having it collapse and spread burning embers everywhere while not firing their pottery(or something).

 

On the same note, people should be allowed to do not-so-smart things as a last-ditch effort, or in different applications.

Why can't we let that guy who broke his last bit of armor in a cave make a quick, unventilated forge to make a armor quick, or let that person make a pit kiln that's not in a pit to make a fiery wall of embers to deter attackers?

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I think he means that when your head is in smoke, you'll get those air bubble things that you get underwater, and take damage when they run out.

This exactly.

 

Also, the block would only generate above the forge block every x seconds, or would have a chance-per-tick of generating a few blocks in a rowThat way you'd have little smoky trails rising into the sky like a real camp fire, that would despawn upon reaching the build limit

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Another alternative (or additional method of despawning) to having smoke despawn only at the build limit would be to have it despawn after a certain amount of time. This way, smoke in an area like a forge chimney would despawn as well, because if it only flew straight up, it wouldn't be able to get to the outside environment through the bend in the chimney. Additionally, you wouldn't have smoke sitting up on your roof forever.

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Another alternative (or additional method of despawning) to having smoke despawn only at the build limit would be to have it despawn after a certain amount of time. This way, smoke in an area like a forge chimney would despawn as well, because if it only flew straight up, it wouldn't be able to get to the outside environment through the bend in the chimney. Additionally, you wouldn't have smoke sitting up on your roof forever.

 

Who said anything about straight up? Have you SEEN thaumcraft flux gas? Or liquid glowstone? They flow just like regular liquids, including around all kinds of corners.

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It does? I've only ever seen it go up. My bad. But even then, I still think the smoke should despawn over time as well as by hitting the build limit, because it wouldn't be able to go through spaces such as opened doors because the doors occupy a block. It would kind of simulate the smoke dissipating through various cracks and openings to the outside world.

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It does? I've only ever seen it go up. My bad. But even then, I still think the smoke should despawn over time as well as by hitting the build limit, because it wouldn't be able to go through spaces such as opened doors because the doors occupy a block. It would kind of simulate the smoke dissipating through various cracks and openings to the outside world.

 

...that explanation has changed my mind on the matter. Kudos, I now support this.

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I'm not opposed to the concept, but the examples presented are a bit lacking :/

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I'm not opposed to the concept, but the examples presented are a bit lacking :/

 

Care to elaborate? Elucidate? Educate? I'd love to know what you mean by that

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Care to elaborate? Elucidate? Educate? I'd love to know what you mean by that

The bloomery requirement has been pointed out as incorrect, as obove.

 

Sawmills don't even exist.

 

The anvil requirement makes "sense", in a way, but is rather obtuse, and I don't think it would be straightforward enough for players. I think a lot of people would get confused, especially because it's hard to communicate such requirements to the player.

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The bloomery requirement has been pointed out as incorrect, as obove.

 

Sawmills don't even exist.

 

The anvil requirement makes "sense", in a way, but is rather obtuse, and I don't think it would be straightforward enough for players. I think a lot of people would get confused, especially because it's hard to communicate such requirements to the player.

 

Wait what?Oh, you mean the OP. No, OP is a stack of sticks. Don't look at that.Look at smoke coming from the forge.

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The anvil requirement makes "sense", in a way, but is rather obtuse, and I don't think it would be straightforward enough for players. I think a lot of people would get confused, especially because it's hard to communicate such requirements to the player.

How about anvils, when placed on weak blocks(leaves, thatch, signs torches, berry bushes, etc) fall through the block and destroy it?

Will that be less confusing?

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ooh, that.. actually gives me an idea...Instead of having the chimney requirements, you could make an upward-flowing 'liquid' block called smoke, that would behave in a manner similar to flux gas from Thaumcraft 4, only it would stack on top of itself and therefore accumulate. It's only texture would be a 'smoke' particle effect, and having it in the same block as your head would start suffocating you exactly the same as water.

Weren't we already discussing this time ago? As far as I can tell, this has gone nowhere since. In every way of understanding of "gone nowhere" part pretty much.

 

On the topic of OP suggestion, only the anvil thing makes a lick of sense. Sawmill not working under the clear sky? What's that requirement supposed to emulate, the sawblade's performance anxiety?

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On the topic of OP suggestion, only the anvil thing makes a lick of sense. Sawmill not working under the clear sky? What's that requirement supposed to emulate, the sawblade's performance anxiety?

 

If I had to think of a reason to require a chimney for a sawmill, the only thing I can think of would be proper ventilation for all of the saw dust. That way there isn't any risk of a spark creating a massive fire, or just having your lungs filled with itty bitty splinters.

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If I had to think of a reason to require a chimney for a sawmill, the only thing I can think of would be proper ventilation for all of the saw dust. That way there isn't any risk of a spark creating a massive fire, or just having your lungs filled with itty bitty splinters.

When you are cutting green-wood, you need to have it season so that it doesn't warp as easily and the natural way to do it is to have the beams of wood sit in a dry area for about a year for the moisture to leave, but modern lumber mills use fire stoves to quickly dry the wood to the specific moisture level that the customer needs. So, you could have the chimney be for wood drying or for other reasons.

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