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Kittychanley

If you want to edit the wiki.

201 posts in this topic

I think i have posted in a wrong section... Wanting to write something too fast without looking elsewhere... Please delete this post.

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I could do some important stuff for the wiki if needed, and don't worry, I ignore any knowledge of numbers in TFC. I believe however, that the wiki should have some stuff set up.

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I could do some important stuff for the wiki if needed, and don't worry, I ignore any knowledge of numbers in TFC. I believe however, that the wiki should have some stuff set up.

 

Come join us in IRC after you create a wiki account and I will get your permissions set up. If I'm not online, send me the information on IRC by using

.tell Kittychanley <insert message here>

And I will get back to you.

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I'd love to help out, but this isn't necessarily an application to edit—I just wanted to share some thoughts about the restrictions. While I understand the importance of limiting edits to trusted sources and editing for appropriateness, the current system obviously results in very few contributions. (I get the impression that Kitty is pretty much alone right now.)

 

The crux of the problem, as I see it, is that new players are the most likely to rely on and thus have immediate edits for the wiki, as well as the most likely to have the energy and motivation to make changes. I feel like there's a way you could harness new-user energy while still incorporating approvals for untrusted users. In fact, I feel like a thriving wiki actually requires both novice and experienced users: novices to suggest immediate clarifications based on their experience learning through the wiki, and experienced users to moderate and contribute more advanced material. A wiki relying solely on experienced or trusted users will, I think, inevitably become stale.

 

A couple of ideas of ways you could more safely allow new-user contributions to grow the wiki:

  • The FlaggedRevs MediaWiki plugin allows moderators to approve edits before they are shown to the public. I haven't used it, but it's very stable and seems like the go-to option for doing this.
  • You could simply unrestrict User and Discussion pages, so that anyone who wants to contribute indirectly can do so—right on the wiki itself, rather than having to come to the forum. (Having to come to the forum to suggest wiki changes probably represents the single biggest attrition factor by far.) Contributions could come in the form of a question or suggestion on a Discussion page or a full-scale mockup of a completely revamped page in Userspace that an admin can simply copy/paste, possibly with editing, rather than starting from scratch.

Either of these would allow unprivileged wiki users to be promoted based on merit on the wiki itself, rather than on the forum—which is important because trustworthy participation in the two does not, as a rule, correlate.

 

At any rate, those are my thoughts. I too am a new user who has already seen many opportunities to contribute based on my learning experience, and would love to be able to act on that. But more importantly, I'd love for everyone who uses the wiki to be able to act on that, in a way that allows admins like Kitty to cherry-pick and filter existing contributions rather than generate everything from scratch. In my view, that's the only way the wiki will be able to thrive. Thanks!

 

 

Edit: *cough*sameusername*cough*

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I'll look into that extension as well as opening up the discussion pages, but the primary reason that the wiki is restricted to trusted users only is to avoid speculation. All recent edits on the wiki can be backed up with the actual source code, and unless there is a bug somewhere, the code doesn't lie. The biggest issue with public wikis is that the average person doesn't know how to read a mod's code, and instead make edits based purely on hypothesis that they think have been confirmed through their testing in game, but have often not actually properly tested.

 

The other issue is consistency. Every single page that I edit/write follows roughly the exact same format for layout as well as grammar. Even though there is a Style Guide which I give to new editors to reference, the majority of the time they ignore it altogether, which often results in me simply tossing out their edit and just rewriting it from scratch. I might cherry-pick one or two sentences from the original edit, but more often than not they are just not consistent, and it's easier for me to just write it myself.

 

It should also be noted that IRC is already essentially being used in the way that you suggested the discussion pages are used. Newer players are often suggesting clarifications, as well as people pointing out mistakes. I have also waived the 20 post requirement in the past for users who are regulars in IRC, but rarely post on the forums. The post requirement is there to prove that you will be active in the community, as well as communicate and ask questions before making changes. As Bioxx stated in the OP, before he implemented the 20 post requirement, he was constantly giving people editing privileges who then in turn never made a single edit.

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Well, again, I'd just point out that the IRC and forum users you've granted access to, based on IRC and forum merit, have not evinced any wiki merit at all. So how effective does that make the current system as a predictor of wiki merit? I feel like you need to grant permissions based on wiki participation, not some other form, because they do not correlate, as evidenced by the current system itself.

 

Out of curiosity, do you know how many wiki accounts are created each week? Most of those users, when they see they still can't make any edits at all—not even Discussion edits, or sending messages via User pages to a moderator—will give up. They don't think to look in the forums, much less IRC—that's either counterintuitive, or it's just not worth the trouble. That's probably your most significant barrier to getting good contributions currently.

 

You may believe that showing community investment makes for a good wiki editor, but I'd argue that that's not what a wiki needs. That's what a wiki moderator needs—but the wiki itself, in order to thrive, simply needs volume: lots of eyeballs, lots of contributions, and lots of moderation. It needs to harness the power of a low barrier-to-entry to attract a high volume of edits and either filter them down to the good ones, or have a large enough active user base to moderate by reversion or correction. The former is what you will likely need to start out with; the latter, having a solid base of other moderators you can trust, is the goal—and that goal won't be reached with the current system of merit.

 

Obviously you will get poor contributions with the good ones—that's just in the nature of a wiki. But the current system results in no contributions at all. Which would you rather have: lots of edits of varying quality, or none at all? There are tradeoffs to both: a thriving wiki means lots of activity but lots of moderating; a closed wiki means lots of DIY. It's possible that granting more open access (whether in the form of approvals or just User/Discussion pages) would actually increase your workload rather than decrease it, at least in the short term—in which case I'd say that's just a necessary step towards attracting other trustworthy mods who can share your workload. But I believe that a substantial enough percentage of edits would be good, and the benefits of building a large user base are great enough, to make a more open system a worthwhile investment.

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Honestly? There were 11 new users in the past week, and that's only because of the increase in popularity thank's to Etho's LP.. before that there was maybe one new user registering on the wiki a month.

 

Edit: I have implemented an extension that will allow registered users to edit the Talk pages, however due to the limits of MediaWiki, they will only be able to edit existing talk pages, and not create ones which do not exist. The only solution to this is to go in and create blank Talk pages for every popular page... which will take a long time.

 

Double Edit: I have also changed the "Denied Permissions" message to explicitly state to either post in this topic, or contact me (with a link to my contact information), if you wish to have permissions.

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Honestly? There were 11 new users in the past week, and that's only because of the increase in popularity thank's to Etho's LP.. before that there was maybe one new user registering on the wiki a month.

 

Ah…so, not quite the sort of volume I expected then. In that case, an approval system which allows even anonymous users to make unapproved edits would probably get you the most volume. It would also allow you to get a sense of registered users' merit, and grant unmoderated access accordingly.

 

 

Edit: I have implemented an extension that will allow registered users to edit the Talk pages, however due to the limits of MediaWiki, they will only be able to edit existing talk pages, and not create ones which do not exist. The only solution to this is to go in and create blank Talk pages for every popular page... which will take a long time.

 

Yikes! That's a bummer. But when they're eventually created, would you consider allowing anonymous users to edit them too, at least on a trial basis? With that few new users registering, even with anonymous edits allowed there would probably be very little traffic on the Talk pages, but at least it would encourage participation and net you a few more pieces of feedback.

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I tend to agree with morganiq...I have trolled the forums for a while and have learned quite a bit on my own.  My boys and I have a server setup on my LAN and have a great time.  I would like to contribute to wiki from what we learn, but I don't do a lot of posting on forums.  I understand the fear of inactive users and possible increase in the need for spam moderation.  While I can't guarantee I will become a super active user, I would like the opportunity to contribute to wiki to help others user like me searching for answers.  This a great mod and deserves the support from the community willing to take the time to contribute.  Thanks for all you do!

 

StaticCling

(Same name on the wiki)

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Yea sure I've been meaning to get around to this for a while.

I have 20 posts, and I've played TFC since the flint tool days.

Peffern

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Yea sure I've been meaning to get around to this for a while.I have 20 posts, and I've played TFC since the flint tool days.Peffern

 

You need to create an account on the wiki first. The forum account doesn't copy over, and I have no record of a user Peffern on the wiki.

 

Edit: nevermind, it just now shows you making an account.

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Is there a need for the wiki to be translated into german?

If so i would do it

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We currently don't have the system in place for the wiki to be translated into different languages, but if it is ever implemented, I will keep you in mind. :)

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Is there a need for the wiki to be translated into german?

If so i would do it

Sorry if my answer is late, but you can help to translate the mod itself if you want : just check here

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If you add me (traisjames), I just figured out how to use the quiver and took some screen shots.  If possible can I write an article and someone edit it for grammar and format before it goes up?

 

(I was Travis Edrington on here but forgot all login information (doesn't help when you have 9 email addresses).

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Hi, I would also like to help editing the wiki, I've been playing with this mod for almost 2 years, but I only registered to the forum in 2013 and only recently started to use it, but I would like to help the mod with my suggestions and contribute to the wiki.

 

 

EDIT: Sorry my wiki username is also CtrlXCtrlV

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JuanVino (wiki username), been playing TFC for a few builds (early 76) And got quite a expanded knowledge of the game, I'd most likely be editing the forgotten part of the wiki, those topics that are there but aren't much of use because of the lack of information/text. One of my main plans is to make a world generation article.

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I can haz wiki account?Username: Awesoman3000 (small m this time)Also regularly edit the vanilla wiki http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Special:Contributions/MinecraftPhotos4U

 

Added. I have sent you a welcome message on your talk page. Please note that we do not follow the same style as the vanilla wiki, so you will need to familiarize yourself with our guidelines.

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Username: Nickasummers

 

I've been playing TFC for quite a while, and I feel like I should stop watching and start contributing to bringing the wiki up to date

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Username: Nickasummers

 

I've been playing TFC for quite a while, and I feel like I should stop watching and start contributing to bringing the wiki up to date

 

I'm going to hold off an adding edit permissions to your account for the sole reason that so much of the wiki needs updating right now due to the 79 release, so I'm ridiculously busy. I will make an exception to this thought with the requirement that you come join us in IRC, so that you are actively in real-time running edits by me for confirmation before you make them.

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I'm going to hold off an adding edit permissions to your account for the sole reason that so much of the wiki needs updating right now due to the 79 release, so I'm ridiculously busy. I will make an exception to this thought with the requirement that you come join us in IRC, so that you are actively in real-time running edits by me for confirmation before you make them.

I would like to edit the wiki as well, unless there are too many people editting it. Just let me know if you guys need help. My name on this is mrjoshiemoto.

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I have updated the original post, please look over the new guidelines.

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