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Trenix

Trenix's Farewell

32 posts in this topic

I'm not going to leave in a rant but I will just calmly leave with a few words. Hope you can understand rather than take me as an aggressor. Anyway, I truly feel the attitude of the developers is a little over the top. The best way to describe it is stubborn and conceded. You guys truly don't know how to build a community. When I or anyone else criticizes your work, you shouldn't take it so personal. That is a very childish way to act, you're supposed to welcome it even though you may not agree with it. It's there to help you not hurt you.This: http://terrafirmacraft.com/f/topic/7449-improved-meal-preparation-ui/Isn’t acceptable and it's pretty much the final straw for me. I put some effort in that and to just say no and lock my thread, was a rather harsh thing to do. It's just a flat out lack of manners and extremely unprofessional. Why bother even attempting to find bugs, suggest improvements, or even new ideas when you can do something so obnoxious. I don't think it's necessary for me to tell you how you should of acted, because I'm not here to be a parent. I've already been suspended before for something that wasn't even intentional, such as editing a post that the admin was in the process of editing, resorting in bringing back text that were supposedly against the rules. I was then read the policy like your mod is some type of big cooperation. Really?I also don't want to talk about the whole believability concept. As soon as I replaced realism to believability, no one questioned that aspect of my suggestions anymore. I'm sort of surprised how a simple manipulation can really turn the tables on here, it could be that maybe some of the developers are too young. I'm even more surprised how you could create a wiki that's been outdated for months and still ask for donations. Well anyway, good luck and you should really look into what I'm saying because it's only for the better. People will always criticize your work, unfortunately that’s the real world and if you’re going to block out every single criticism from people who aren’t your friends, you’re going to become a failure in life. Also please don’t get cocky with your mod’s popularity, it has unknown lag and the animals can't even walk properly. Wish the best! ~TrenixEdit: I'm actually extremely surprised that I wasn't suspended nor locked by posting this.

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Trenix,

 

You've been a very active and vocal member of the community. You've brought new vigor to old discussions, and made many suggestions. Some have met great resistance, yet you've continued to bring new ideas to the community despite all that. Thank you for your contibution to the community, however brief. Who knows, maybe a year from now somebody will reopen one of your old threads. Good luck in whatever you're doing next, and may the sun always shine upon you!

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Hey Trenix don't worry about kitty she's always a bit on edge. I'm sorry to ear you're leaving I always liked your post. I wish you good luck and succes toward wathever you're wanting. Stay true to yourself and don't let them put you down. See ya!

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@Kitty - I guess, Trenix is right here. I do believe that you put quite some time and work into the new meal GUI, but so did Trenix for his suggestion, and outright locking it because you are (understandably) unwilling to declare your own effort naught does seem a bit harsh and unfair too.

Nobody forces you to make this change, but you should at least give the community a chance to respond, to state what they like or not, even if this change will never happen. I personally am happy with the current UI (I think most people are), but his suggestion is valid nevertheless. Besides, I assume you will have to rewrite the GUI if ever new meal types like soup or stew come into place :)

Back to topic: this reaction was quite the slap in the face, and if I remember correctly, not even suggestions about animal excrement for fertilizer or whatever have been locked in the first instance!

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I honestly didn't want to single out Kittychanley, but I mind as well do it since it doesn't seem fair to the other developers which really had no part in it. She really is giving TerraFirmaCraft a bad name. This is such a great mod with so much potential and it's a real shame to have someone's egocentrism ruin the game's reputation. Take note that I'm not singling her out because she's a girl. I've seen her bring that up before on the forums so I'm telling you right now this has nothing to do with it. This has to do with being professional and respectful. I know how coding works, I've used to do it years ago but I was never afraid to scrap my work and I never got offended when people criticized me. It's not insulting and I'm not being ungrateful, but you can't expect to always be perfect.You need to be more open to other’s opinion, otherwise don’t make a suggestion section on your forums. That type of mentality is very corruptible, as you can already see by the abusive actions that have already been taken place. I’ve recently scrapped $200 of clothing because people didn’t like my designs. Now I can get angry at them for not liking my clothes or I can blame myself for making designs that people weren’t interested in. I honestly would love to blame them but let’s be realistic here, or should I say believable? How can I move forward with that state of mind? You see none of that would have happened if people were actually truthful and told me that I need to do things differently. Yet I welcome failure, because without failure you can never learn from your mistakes.But no hard feelings, I really don’t care. I got a whole pack of suggestions stored on my computer which were intended for vanilla Minecraft and could have been possibly adopted by this mod. Yet, what’s the point when the forum admin isn’t accepting of ideas? I’m not leaving because I’m hurt, I’m leaving because whether I’m on the forums or not, I don’t think it really matters. Kittychanley is narrow minded and isn’t capable of arguing with, it’s her word and that’s all. Once again I can careless if you're going to add my idea or not, but the community really didn't even have a say and we weren't even capable of discussion this feature like adults. That is the problem...

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Aww bummer this had to happen. In academia, this can happen too when too much is expected of a collaboration. I share my work with others who in turn ignore it. But meh, in the end i did it for myself and not only to please others. Anyway, suggestions can be rejected and it's normal. The manner of rejection depends on the person and mood. If you take your ideas to heart, best to execute them yourself.

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It is really sad that you're going to leave us, Trenix. But I can perfectly understand your decision. On the other hand I can somewhat understand Kitty. Yes, she overreacted that's for sure, but we are only humans and everybody makes mistakes. And Kitty did contribute A LOT to the community, and to the wiki.

The underlying problem is, in my opinion, not enough moderators. This is pretty lively forum and Kitty has to take care of it on top of bugfixing, wiki editing and her life. And sometimes it can be too much.

Yes, as far as I can see she may be stubborn sometimes, but on most occasions she's right, or maybe should I say most of community and/or Devs agree with her.

I'd like to see you back some day, as discussing with You was fun.

So good luck, have a nice day and (I hope to) see you again ;)

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Two things:

 

Both devs are young and most likely students with little industry experience, this is "their" project and they try to handle it best they can.

 

They do it in their free time and if i had to handle a support forum in my free time, the word "attitude" would be written all over it...

 

 

But it is true. The behaviour sometimes is very unprofessional. Only considering changes that will cost the dev little time is ... unprofessional. The question is how much will the product benefit and if the executive decides that this feature will make it into the product all the programmer hears is the question "can you get it done in time" and if you keep answering that "no, it will take me too much time" than sooner or later you will be replaced by someone more "productive". Its a f'ed up industry tbh.

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(...)But it is true. The behaviour sometimes is very unprofessional. Only considering changes that will cost the dev little time is ... unprofessional. The question is how much will the product benefit and if the executive decides that this feature will make it into the product all the programmer hears is the question "can you get it done in time" and if you keep answering that "no, it will take me too much time" than sooner or later you will be replaced by someone more "productive". Its a f'ed up industry tbh.

Erm, why is it, that this "product" is constantly compared to the commercial game industry with publisher and developer, with a lot of money involved?There is no executive, no publisher, no money. If the creators of TFC decide one day that the time and effort and headaches at dealing with how big this project and its community has become just isn't worth it anymore, there is absolutely nothing you can do about it.As far as I remember that these are exactly the reasons why The Creator Notch has left it all behind ...
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Because if you treat this like your own personal playground you will eventually fail and piss off a lot of people along the way. Ofc why would you care about people on the internet but i believe that no one who publishes a mod or tool or anything open source has that evil attitude.

 

You want to provide something "good" and to achieve that it isnt wrong to stick to some industry guidelines because they have proven to be effective. No need to reinvent the wheel.

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Trenix, the TFC devs consider community input far more than any other Minecraft mod developer I know of

 

They have no obligation whatsoever to listen to community input. They can make whatever they want, and people can either play it or don't

 

As a practical manner, because Kitty reads every single post on this forum. It makes perfect sense to say no to a suggestion that has 0% chance of happening. Maybe immediately locking the topic was unneccesary, but its not uncalled for. Whats the point of allowing discussion for something that won't happen

 

That being said, Kitty clearly tries to do too much around here. Clearly real life+forum administrator+wiki admin+aspiriations of becoming a TFC developer are too much considering the lack of progress on the wiki

 

I don`t know if there is anyone who wants some of that responsibility (if there isn`t then well we will have to live with the lack of progress)

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Trenix, the TFC devs consider community input far more than any other Minecraft mod developer I know of

 

They have no obligation whatsoever to listen to community input. They can make whatever they want, and people can either play it or don't

 

As a practical manner, because Kitty reads every single post on this forum. It makes perfect sense to say no to a suggestion that has 0% chance of happening. Maybe immediately locking the topic was unneccesary, but its not uncalled for. Whats the point of allowing discussion for something that won't happen

 

That being said, Kitty clearly tries to do too much around here. Clearly real life+forum administrator+wiki admin+aspiriations of becoming a TFC developer are too much considering the lack of progress on the wiki

 

I don`t know if there is anyone who wants some of that responsibility (if there isn`t then well we will have to live with the lack of progress)

 

 

I offered a short while ago to help with the wiki however I'm still very new so there is more code related things I must learn first. I'm very new to the community and not going to worry too much over it I also work a full time job so maybe it was for the best as that sort of thing takes lots of time. However I do feel that when your drowning in work and someone offers to help, you should at least see what they have to offer.

 

Again I am very new here but isn't the point of a forum to allow conversation to happen? Unless I'm just crazy locking a topic shouldn't have anything to do with wheather it has a chance of happening or not. If the devs are so 'immune' to input and " can make anything them want" what's the harm in letting the conversation go? JUst post with "I have no plans to change the current UI" THere see? Simple polite and clearly giving no false hope while still allowing the community to chat about this UI concept. 

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It's all "mine" mentality with Kitty. People give ideas and report bugs, only for all that to be claimed by someone who isn't even grateful for it nor believes that anyone had any part in it. We're doing the work of an average game tester and we're not even asking to be paid for it, just asking for some respect. You're either building the mod with the community or without it, if it's without it, then there really is no purpose of this forum. I honestly would love to go on the wiki and fix it from the ground up, so it could be understandable and finally up to date. But Kitty doesn't appear to be seeking help, she just wants to do everything on her own and it's taking a toll on her work. I'm also not going to put any effort in something that will be removed shortly afterwards or be taken without any gratitude.I wouldn't mind coming back if my suggestion was reopened and I stopped getting rude responses such as, "No, this won't be added". Not sure who you talk to but that type of attitude isn't acceptable anywhere in the real world. If you're still in school, then when your teacher gives you feedback about your work or a even presentation, go and tell them, "Yeah, I'm not going to change that" and you'll see what they'll say afterwards.

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I'm feeling a lot of entitlement around here. I'd personally prefer it if the devs responded to suggestions more often with "No, this won't be added" or "we'll consider this idea". That way there's no uncertainty, and you know that on a particular idea, you're wasting your time. Discussions on ideas that aren't going to be added just create more work for the devs, since they have to read everything anyway.

 

One thing I'd like to point out is that you're criticizing a person here. Everything you say about somebody hurts them, so soften your criticisms a little. And Trenix, the issue with your last statement is that Kitty isn't the student, she's the CEO.

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The correct corporate analogies would be:

Bioxx is the CEO. dunkleosteus is the Vice President of the company. Kitty is the manager of the wiki and forum with aspirations of becoming a Vice President

 

As far as managment goes, Kitty has the lowest status. Which means she has to due the menial tasks noone else wants to do (like read every forum post) and filter out the important forum information from the crap. She will presumedly have to do that until the next aspiring developer comes along that all three of them approve. This is to be expected.

 

The only thing out of the ordinary here is that Kitty's current responsibilites also include management of the wiki. Someone else should really take over that responsibility. It doesn't take a developer to maintain a wiki. Of course if there is noone Kitty finds acceptable to take over that responsibility, then well the wiki development will have to lag until someone acceptable steps up to the plate.

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I'm feeling a lot of entitlement around here. I'd personally prefer it if the devs responded to suggestions more often with "No, this won't be added" or "we'll consider this idea". That way there's no uncertainty, and you know that on a particular idea, you're wasting your time. Discussions on ideas that aren't going to be added just create more work for the devs, since they have to read everything anyway.

The problem is that there is no room for improvement of a particular idea. Ideas that are suggested aren't always good which is why the communities responses are needed to further refine it into a great suggestion. Saying no is not only rude, but it's not allowing room for improvement. Maybe during the discussion we could of instead talked about slightly tweaking the current UI into being more understandable. I can't say what would of came of the discussion, because it wasn't allowed to happen. It's one thing to say no to an idea, but it's another to abuse your powers as a forum admin and lock a thread that has broken no rules. This is practically tyranny. Forums aren't there to be used in this kind of manner, this is a place of discussion. 

One thing I'd like to point out is that you're criticizing a person here. Everything you say about somebody hurts them, so soften your criticisms a little. And Trenix, the issue with your last statement is that Kitty isn't the student, she's the CEO.

Many people keep talking about this mod like it's some kind of company or product, it's not. I'm simply saying that it doesn't matter who she think she is, you simply just don't act like that in the real world. Also people need to ease up with criticism sounding so demeaning, it's not. It's there to help not hurt, you're not going to impress everyone and everyone needs to understand that. Suppressing people who you don't agree with is flat out screwed up.

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I assume some of the reluctance to have other people help with the wiki is due to the person who had permission and screwed it up a while ago. Remember that? Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice and you are never editing the wiki again.... or something like that.

 

http://terrafirmacraft.com/f/topic/7257-solved-cant-access-the-wiki/?hl=%20can#39;t%20%20access%20%20wiki

 

 

Would be a good time to let us help out a bit though.

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I've seen plenty of people get fired from being impulsive. We have a wiki editor who's left it outdated for months, an abusive forum admin who never takes responsibility for their actions, and a community manager who is flat out rude to it's community. If she did mess up, all she needs to do is apologize. The fact that she clearly doesn't want to, shows that she's not good enough for the job. Kitty has some real issues when it comes to authority. Never have I seen a community manager who did the complete opposite of building a community. If she's really the lowest status then I'll just wait for the other developers to replace her after they find out the person they put in charge. That's when I'll return.

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Wowowow dude, tone it down a little.

 

Kitty may have her flaws but from a little googling i'm guessing she is still going to some form of school/university so give her a break.

 

I'd like to know how Bioxx thinks about this all, after all, he is the man in charge.

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I personally don't think that Kitty has acted at all out of line. She's dedicated all her time to managing the wiki, reading and managing the forums, and handling our bug report. You say that it has been out-dated for months. As per the developer's wishes, the wiki is largely closed for public editing. You can stop blaming Kitty for this, because it's not her decision alone. Kitty isn't the sole wiki editor; there are 10 pages of people applying to be able to edit the wiki. Any one of them could have added the relevant information and sent it to Kitty for approval. There is even a process to go through to become more trusted on the wiki, being able to make larger changes without needed approval. If you want to blame anybody for the wiki not being updated, blame this community for not stepping up. Sure, some people why apply get rejected, and rightly so. Osxvictoria, you have fewer than 5 posts. Why should you be added to the trusted list of people, when the community barely knows you?

 

You complain about her conduct on the forums. Be glad that you're getting a response from the developers. They are under no obligation to give you feedback, or listen to your ideas. And yet, they do. Most of their feedback is actually quite civil, considering how terrible some suggestions that get posted are. Even when she doesn't like an idea, Kitty dutifully reads every new post and let's the discussion keep going. Sometimes she even makes a change that she personally doesn't like. Her job would be a lot easier is she just shut down every suggestion that has no chance of being added. In exchange for working with us in the suggestions thread, she has a lot of say in what gets added, and what doesn't. You suggested a change to something that was quite recently changed, and took a lot of time to do. As such, she informed you that it would not be changed, and closed the thread (Good thing too, your new UI's "counter top" was weird ). There was nothing more to say on the matter. Discussion would be moot. The developers had spoken. There's nothing wrong with stopping a discussion about a feature that is not getting changed. You're just chuffed that your idea was rejected. If you had a problem with it, you could have civilly messaged her and asked why it was shut down so fast, but instead you come here and start a smear campaign.

 

As a final note, Kitty has been reading this thread (you can see when somebody is looking at it). Rest assured, she's seeing all your comments, and allowing you to air your grievances. How's that for not abusing one's powers?

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Wow, Trenix, that was unexpected. It's pretty sad to see such rudeness towards someone like Kitty.

It's wrong on every level to compere mod development and working as a programmer. It is not work, it's goddamn hobby! And they want to share theur work with us.

Think about how many stupid or offensive posts Kitty has to deal with. Niw think how would you react as a forum admin. Sometimes people just get fed up and act not as polite as always.

I'm sad noone thinks about how would this forum look without kitty. Some of you might remember. Kitty makes a lot of great work managing this mess.

As I said before someone to help Kitty would be a great addition yo the staff. For now, let's try to be civil and keep the forum tidy by ourselves, please.

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I had really hoped to not have to reply to this thread but circumstances clearly warrant it.

 

First of all I will address the original issue that started this mess, that being the UI suggestion thread. As I discussed with Kitty after the fact, I personally would not have locked the suggestion. That said, her response was on point and doesn't require sugar coating. If its not going to be implemented, its best to just say it instead of giving anyone the idea that it has a chance.

 

Now as for all of the Kitty bashing, I'd like it to stop here. Criticism is one thing, bashing is another. Trenix has had his opportunity to spout how he feels about how Kitty manages the community so I feel that it is only right that we air out everything regarding the past incident that set the stage for this thread. In the interest of full disclosure I'm going to release and redact an email exchange between Kitty and Trenix that occurred after she had to warn and suspend him. If Kitty has any negative feelings whatsoever towards Trenix, they are in my opinion fully warranted. However, Kittychanley handled herself in what is, in my opinion, a professional manner. There was certainly not an abuse of power going on here. If you feel that Kitty is being unfair, go spend a few minutes on the Minecraft Forge forums where Lex rules with an iron fist.

 

 

 

From: Trenix
Date: Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 12:46 PM
To: Kittychanley



Lol, wha? I don't get how anything I said was abusive in any way. Thought forums are for having reasonable discussions, I’m not trolling or cursing out people or anything of that sort so what’s the deal? I’ve been told that I was “not smart” which is far more offensive than what I’ve ever said to anyone. I mean to get a warning an be suspended for 24 hours for doing nothing?
----------
From: Kittychanley
Date: Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 12:49 PM
To: 
Trenix


I edited your post to redact the abortion argument. You edited your post after that to put the argument back in. Hence, suspension.
 
----------
From: Trenix
Date: Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 1:00 PM
To: Kittychanley



I didn't do that intentionally, I was just editing my post probably before you even edited it. I usually edit my posts numerous of times in a row to fix grammar errors and such, check for yourself. You guys seem pretty hostile towards people who offer their feedback, I mean you clearly have a grudge against me to think I really went out of my way to add abortion back into the post just to go against your administrative powers, like seriously? Why would I go through all that trouble, unless you think I'm a complete asshole because I'm passionate with my discussions. Also why can't I talk about abortion anyway, is there a rule I missed somewhere? Would be more appropriate to just send me a message stating that I shouldn't talk about that in a respectful manner and I would of been more than happy to remove it. You guys even attempting to build a relationship with your community?
 
----------
From: Kittychanley
Date: Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 1:53 PM
To: Trenix



The same policy is followed for all forum members - If a post contains content that warrants a warning point, the user is warned. After the warning point has been confirmed, at which point the member gets a notification, the post is edited to remove the offending content. If the post is then edited by the user to put the content back in, the user receives a 24 hour suspension. This has absolutely nothing to do with me having a grudge against you. This is standard policy, and it applies to all members.
 
Please keep in mind that this forum is for discussion regarding a Minecraft mod. Controversial topics such as abortion have absolutely no context here, and as such do not belong.
 
There are many different types of feedback. You are obviously very passionate about your opinions, and as such your feedback is very opinionated to the point where it itself is almost interpreted as hostile. We do not respond to all feedback in a hostile manner, but we will respond to feedback in the same manner that said feedback was given.
 
We do strive to build a good relationship with our community. However, our community has been around for over 2 years now, and when new members come barging in attacking many aspects of the mod, we usually protect our current community, rather than accept this new person into it.
 
At some point you got this idea in your head of what TerraFirmaCraft is, and what it should be. Unfortunately, this idea is different from our Developer's ideas, and therefore it is wrong. You may not agree with that statement, but as you are not a developer of this mod, it doesn't matter.
 
Your posts are styled in such a manner that some of our forum members believe that you are trying to shove your ideologies down their throats. You may not intend to come off in such a manner, but you are. The 24 hour suspension still stands not because of the original policy, but at the request of our community to give you some time to cool off. Before you start ranting about any given topic, take a moment to consider how our community will interpret that rant. If the post could only be interpreted as constructive criticism that is not a direct attack on the mod, then post it.
 
----------
From: Trenix
Date: Wed, Nov 5, 2014 at 2:41 PM
To: KittyChanley



Like I said, I was in the process of editing the post when you went through with changing it. Meaning that all of the original text was still there and I had no clue that you even went through with the edit, so once I updated the post it all returned unintentionally. Please don't act stubborn and bring up policies like you just a pawn in a big cooperation where you're incapable of making a change because you unrightfully suspended me for something I never meant to do. It was an accident that was created because you held a grudge, lets be honest here this is the consequences of aggression; you make dumb mistakes. However I'm sure you were just looking for anything to get me off the forums though.

I was using abortion as an example to further prove why an egg is actually a meat. Now if it's a sensitive topic, then I understand why it serves no purpose on the forums. I'm capable of reason, but if you just want to sensor me because I view things differently than you and others, than that’s pretty abusive. I’m not hostile, angry, or even attempting to be disrespectful. Please show me exactly where I’ve even shown such behavior. These words are text, they have no emotion behind it. Read my text as if I’m happy and you’ll get the impression that I’m not trying to cause any disruption, which I’m truly not trying to do. 

But anyway I was going to say more but it’s useless. We both know damn well that none of this is up for discussion, you’d rather be stubborn than be a sensible human being. The real reason I’m getting this hostility is because I speak my mind and everyone doesn’t agree with what I say so they attempt to suppress me and it’s actually what they did. This is why we fight for freedom in America, because too much of this shit is happening. Tyrants always fail one way or another, I mean your community could of been bigger and I was going to even donate, but being respectful goes a long way. Also as a forum admin for a community, I advise you to take a class in philosophy. Only morons who are incapable of intellectual thinking get angry during a logical discussion.

 

I'm going to leave it up to the community to decide if this person requires any more of our time. I'm not going to ban Trenix at this time to prove some point or even warn him due to his continual bashing of a member of my team, even though I feel that I have justification to do so, as that would send the wrong message here. 

 

I would like to add that I have full confidence in Kitty to perform her functions as part of our team. Sometimes shes a bit rough around the edges, but that's ok, we all have our personality quirks. Just ask Dunk if its always fun to work with me. Hint: its not. As for the wiki being a bit out of date, it sucks when that happens but until we get more people that can be trusted to work on the wiki, we're all just SOL. 

 

Thank you to Hubertus and the others who've been able to see this entire thing clearly.

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I think any person without a personal grudge against Kitty is going to see that Trenix is acting unreasonable here. Trenix clearly has some misplaced entitlement issues here. The mere fact that Trenix even thought "I will leave if something isn't done about Kitty" would accomplish anything is a symptom of a grossly inflated sense of worth to this forum.

 

Noone is going to look down on you for banning Trenix.

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I think issues like this should be left to the people involved and the one who is eventually liable (owner of the forum).

 

Bashing either side is only gonna start group dynamics in a bad way, so please keep it to a level that is out of elementary school.

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Thank you Bioxx for your input and I'm actually glad you brought my e-mail toward kitty. I really don't feel embarrassed of what I said, I could of been a little more nicer but getting a cold shoulder without a full explanation tick me off a little, as it would anyone. As for a professional and respectful way of handling a suggestion that a developer has no interest in changing or implementing, this is how you should handle it. It could be for future reference down the road, possibly when I'm gone.

"Interesting suggestion, however a code rewrite would take too long to make it worth the while. Maybe in the future."

Green: Give the person some credit for going out of their way into making a suggestion that will benefit your mod. Saying something as simple as "interesting" is enough to act in a respectful manner for their contribution.
Blue: Give a simple explanation of why you're not going to add it rather than an excuse, that's unprofessional.
Red: This is the nicest way to say no, even though you're most likely not going to add it in the future, it gives a person some hope and satisfaction that your suggestion was recognized. When a developer says a closure such as that, the discussion usually ends. Locking a thread however, is just simply abusing a power. I didn't do anything wrong, just invested time to put together a well thought out suggestion, only to be told no in a disrespectful manner and then be punished by getting my thread locked. Sorry but my morality says that was out of line and cruel. Really, how do you expect me to act after something like that happened?

You may think that telling people no for suggestion isn't a big deal, but it is for someone who put a whole lot of effort into their suggestion. From what I've seen, people have already complained and got fed up with that type of attitude. It's not really about giving people false hope, but rather recognition for their contribution. The type of response I received made me not want to contribute ever again, put yourself into my shoes, you're honestly going to tell me that you wouldn't feel the same?

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