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LiesTech

Are apples the new sugar cane?

14 posts in this topic

Well I just started playing again (not really I just don't have much time) and I got my first real sugarcane harvest in (30 ish plants) and I thought 'Rum, give me Rum me boys!' So I made sugar by sealing 15lbs of sugarcane in a couple barrels of water and got back... 22oz of sugar. Barely enough for a wee dram let alone to get rip roaring drunk on. Meanwhile half a dozen apple trees produced enough apples to make around 16 barrels of Cider. And I think 'What!?! I would need 50lbs of sugarcane to make just one little barrel of the hard stuff while a mere 10lbs of corn can make a barrel of whisky and an apple tree can make two barrels of cider.'

 

In short, do you think apples are OP now compared to what sugarcane used to be and has sugarcane been nerfed beyond usability?

 

Thank you, LiesTECH

 

side note: If I need 50lbs of sugarcane for a barrel of rum that would mean at least 100 plants, maybe more....

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15 lbs of sugarcane? like, 1.5 full stacks?

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It's 50oz to get 5oz of sugar (See wiki: Barrel) for a total of 400oz sugarcane to get enough sugar for a full barrel of rum.  Since both are a luxury I personally don't have a problem with the amount of work/effort/time it takes to get it.

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Um Xen, I think your math is off a bit:

  • To have successful fermentation a minimum of 100oz of the source material is required (and sometimes more in my experience*), that is 10oz per 1000mb
  • I used 15lbs (or 240oz of raw sugarcane) and got 22.1oz of sugar
  • So multiply by five to get a conservative 110oz of sugar for guaranteed fermentation.
  • That comes to a staggering 1200oz of raw sugarcane, requiring 7.5 barrels of water to process.
  • When you divide 1200oz by 7.5oz (approx. avg. yield per mature sugarcane) you get roughly 160 plants to get a single barrel of rum.

*I have 100oz of rye flour in two different barrels and they have not fermented in half a game year. Same with some cornmeal.

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Math is from the wiki going by the minimum oz to create a full barrel of alcohol.

 

*That sounds like a bug.  I've got barrels of vodka/beer/corn whiskey/cider and soon I'll be adding rye whiskey and sake to the stash.  Hoping to have enough sugarcane to make rum after this years harvest.

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I had a bug with making alcohol, where it would never finish, it even lost the date indicator. Try unsealing and resealing, that fixed it for me.

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Sugar/Rum is one of the things that i have only very little of. I have all kinds of beverages (even in glass bottles... for the show effect) but i miss rum.

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Um Xen, I think your math is off a bit:

  • To have successful fermentation a minimum of 100oz of the source material is required (and sometimes more in my experience*), that is 10oz per 1000mb
  • I used 15lbs (or 240oz of raw sugarcane) and got 22.1oz of sugar
  • So multiply by five to get a conservative 110oz of sugar for guaranteed fermentation.
  • That comes to a staggering 1200oz of raw sugarcane, requiring 7.5 barrels of water to process.
  • When you divide 1200oz by 7.5oz (approx. avg. yield per mature sugarcane) you get roughly 160 plants to get a single barrel of rum.

*I have 100oz of rye flour in two different barrels and they have not fermented in half a game year. Same with some cornmeal.

 

Where did you get these numbers? Because the ones on the wiki come directly from the code. The only reason that you would have unfermented full barrels with 100oz of something in it is if A. You sealed it while running 79.10 or older; B. The 100oz food was heavily decayed, so the actual usable weight on it was less than 40oz or C. You filled it with salt water instead of fresh water.

  • To have successful fermentation, you need a minimum of 1,000 mB of water, and 4 ounces of food. Here's a screenshot proving that it works, if it says Output: Rum at the bottom, then it is successful. If your barrel doesn't say an output message at the bottom, then something else is wrong.

     Posted Image

  • Sugar cane gives 1 oz of sugar for every non-decayed 10 ounces of sugar cane. The reason you only got 22.1 oz of sugar is because out of your 240 oz raw sugarcane, 19 ounces of that was decay (about 8%).
  • To make a full barrel of rum, you only need 40 oz of sugar, and therefore 400 oz of sugar cane, which only takes 2.5 water barrels to process.
  • The average yield of sugar cane is 8 oz.
  • 400/8 = 50, meaning that you have to harvest about 50 plots of sugar cane in order to get enough sugar to make a full barrel.
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So my chances of going ARRRRRRRRRRR increase... slightly ?

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Also as far as apple/fruit trees being OP. From make berry bushes unpick able suggestion.

-snip- 3. Completely off topic, but after the addition of berry bushes, I see how ridiculously OP fruit trees are in comparison since they supply fruit every random tick they are in season. Methinks fruit trees should be nerfed to supply fruit once a month like berry bushes.

So a re-balance of them is possible.
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I had a bug with making alcohol, where it would never finish, it even lost the date indicator. Try unsealing and resealing, that fixed it for me.

 

I've observed that as well, and had the same issue of it never finishing when making vinegar, as well as losing the date indicator on pickled food I had put into vinegar. In each case, I had picked up and moved the full barrel after sealing (as I've worked out a grouping of barrels in different stages of food preservation to places marked by signs so I know what I have where). So I guess that the act of picking up and replacing the barrels somehow removed the sealing date. As you say, resealing fixed it, both adding the date and in case of alcohol/vinegar allowing the process to go forward.

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Carrying sealed barrels has all kinds of bugs but they are usually fixed by resealing them.

 

Making stuff in barrels can also be interrupted (somehow) when the food decays to a point where it no longer has enough. I put some food with 3% decay in barrel to create something, dont remember what it was, next day i checked and the process didnt finish and it didnt show any message and the food had 4% decay and dropped below a limit. Just make sure to put fresh stuff in it.

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Yeah, I have not used the wiki since 79 came around as it still has that 'under construction' banner. Until then I have been just using the change log when I'm curious about something. I think I might have just mixed up vinegar's requirement with alcohol's. Those bullet points must have jumped around on me.

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If you follow me on twitter @Kittychanley , I tweet whenever a major page of the wiki has been updated. The majority of pages also have a history section at the bottom, which you can use to see which version the page has been updated to.

 

Edit: If you want to quickly sort through my twitter for only tweets about the wiki, search for the hashtag #TFCWiki

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