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TimothyWiggins127

Slings!

25 posts in this topic

Have you read, understood, and followed all of the rules listed in large text at the top of the suggestions forum?(Yes/No): Yes
Answering "no" to the above question will result in your post being deleted.

Hello! I was talking to a friend of mine about ancient technology and we thought that slings might be a great addition to TFC2. The sling would likely be crafted out of fibrous material such as birchbark rope or jute fiber and would use rocks (possibly knapped into a ball shape?) as ammunition. The sling would be loaded by right clicking while having a rock in the player's inventory. The player would then hold right click to swing the sling around (animated texture to show swinging, maybe?). A bar would appear with a line in the middle, and another line that swings left and right through the bar. The closer the lines are when the player release, the closer the projectile would be to the player's crosshair (Alternatively, the bar could be circular, and positioned around the crosshair rather than with the rest of the HUD). This would create varying accuracy and make the use of the sling tricky and (I think) quite fun. It would make a decent stone-age ranged weapon and add more variety to combat. Hopefully we'll have some squirrels or other small animals to one-shot with these things.

This is my first post here, so I'm sorry if I haven't formatted this correctly. Let me hear your comments and criticism!

Edited by TimothyWiggins127
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What if when pressing the left mouse the movement starts in a circular shape and you have to release the right moment to hit your target? This way players would have to actually train to get the feel of the weapon and it would be a learned skill. One where some players would never be good and some others would excel.  

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Slings will be even more desirable if javelins/arrows are more difficult to create than a sling is.

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What would we use as ammunition?

If the stone weight is implemented, then using stones as ammo would take up an incredible amount of inventory space. Maybe knapping ammo?

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Maybe craft stones directly to sling-stones.  Perhaps at a small loss as not all stones are fit to be used as projectiles. So say, drop 10 stones into the crafting area and get 5 sling-stones.

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Fun idea, but I agree with subarctic, the existing missile weapons would need rebalanced in order to make a sling attractive, if the sling has wonky usage mechanics.   Also leather should be an option for creating the sling.  I'd say just use rocks as they are.  It'll presumably have a reduced damage output vs other weapons, so they'll need a lot anyway.

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What if when pressing the left mouse the movement starts in a circular shape and you have to release the right moment to hit your target? This way players would have to actually train to get the feel of the weapon and it would be a learned skill. One where some players would never be good and some others would excel.  

The whole "releasing at the right moment" thing is the key. I was trying to get that across, but I guess I didn't.

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I could see this being functional. A good slinger would be OP though, since rocks would probably do crush damage rather than piercing, and then slings would be a ranged weapon strong against skeletons (arrows and javelins do no damage to skeletons). If accuracy was difficult, I could see this being pretty cool though. (my bad, I thought this was TFC1 sorry about the confusing bit about dev stopping)

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 *snip* Maybe someone will submit it as a PR though. I think Kitty and Bioxx said no more TFC development.

This is the right place for TFC2 suggestions, right?

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Fun idea, but I agree with subarctic, the existing missile weapons would need rebalanced in order to make a sling attractive, if the sling has wonky usage mechanics.   Also leather should be an option for creating the sling.  I'd say just use rocks as they are.  It'll presumably have a reduced damage output vs other weapons, so they'll need a lot anyway.

I agree, I think arrows and javelin shafts should need  steam work to make them straight, also arrows should need a head, even if it is stone it should be knapped. Bows should be carved and even if possible to do with a stone knife it should take time and with a chance of ruining the piece and having to start over.

I do wood carving as a hobby, and is very unforgivable, one wrong chipped and you either change the design or start again.

One of the problems I see is how at least in tfc 1 leather was put after the metal tech, and I think the sling is one of the most simple weapons and should be one of the first accessible to the player.

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One of the problems I see is how at least in tfc 1 leather was put after the metal tech

You can make leather in large clay vessels.  I *think* alcohol is the only thing large vessels can't do, that barrels can.  Flux can be a big stumbling block though.

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You can make leather in large clay vessels.  I *think* alcohol is the only thing large vessels can't do, that barrels can.  Flux can be a big stumbling block though.

You right, I always forget about Large Vessels.

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Newly spawned players would probably have immediate access to tools which deal melee damage: knifes (piercing), axes (slashing), or hammers (crushing). Seems reasonable to have ranged weapons for each damage type be the next step up the tech tree.

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Dunk has a point about the skeletons, although I'm guessing that skeletons won't be so omnipresent in TFC2 as they are now.  If slings were intended as a hunting weapon for small game, then I would think the damage could be scaled down sufficiently to only be a real threat to small animals.  Maybe let the player make lead sling bullets for better damage.

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*snip*  If slings were intended as a hunting weapon for small game, then I would think the damage could be scaled down sufficiently to only be a real threat to small animals.  Maybe let the player make lead sling bullets for better damage.

This is perfect. exactly what I was going for.

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This is the right place for TFC2 suggestions, right?

 

Yes it is. I don't think Dunk was paying attention and thought this was a suggestion for TFC1.

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This would be wonderful.  I also wouldn't mind having the ability to just THROW stones a short distance as an early Stone Age ranged weapon.  Maybe knapping it to a size usable to throw easily.  I always wanted to be able to just throw rocks, and they wouldn't need to be really damaging, just a way to be able to slightly hurt skeletons at range and hunt small game.  Also to get that bear's attention and lure it to the cliff edge to knock it in the pit and slowly kill it with rocks thrown from above!

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I would love to see TFC2 have the ancient shepherd's sling, or rock sling, make an appearance. since a greater focus on combat is coming, and nomadic shepherds are going to become a little more fun to be, I'd love to see their classic weapon.

 

But why add it?

 

First off, the weapon fills a much (In my opinion) niche, with a ranged weapon that actually can hurt skeletons worth a darn. Also, having ammo everywhere will be nice.

 

Reasons for addition in a slightly more structured manner:

1. A historic weapon associated with a common player type

2. Capable ranged damage without crafted munitions, 

3. Simple to craft, but potentially upgrade-able.

4. potentially skill-based (Much like blacksmithing)

 

On the subject of skill upgrades:

I feel like skills should be very state dependent, for example, having experience with a long sling wouldn't transfer to a short sling, having a lot of practice with overhand swings won't transfer to side or under-hand swings, and having a lot of experience with chert won't transfer to basalt.

 

Basically, the following would be important factors:

1. stone weight

2. sling length

3 swing type

 

Players may or may not be able to use different swing types.

 

In some cases, it's actually important - for example a lighter stone type will be at full power after an overhand swing while a heavy one will take a sidehand swing, and a denser still rock will take an underhand swing.

 

Additionally, the sling will create a use for lead.

 

Sling bullets were common and extremely effective, and almost always cast from lead. I think these should be readily cast with a ceramic mold from 10 units of lead per. this is obviously totally subject to change.

 

Anyways, I do have more thoughts but this is the most basic overview and is totally up for revision. It could also be implemented with a mechanic that requires you to time the shots (At least for a long sling, which is essentially "Parked" by spinning it over the head before casting it forward to fire the stone or bullet, and the timing to release could be up to the player)

Edited by Kittychanley
Merged duplicate suggestion
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12 hours ago, gtvpo said:

and having a lot of experience with chert won't transfer to basalt

This really does not make sense.

 

Anyway, the idea is good I think every weapon should be more complex.

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6 hours ago, Darmo said:

Another thread on the same subject, with exact same title right down to the exclamation point.  This is why it's good to search the forums before posting.

Crap, I knew i forgot something

 

Please merge this then, admins if you are watching. Thanks for the heads up darmo, feel like an idiot now.

 

6 hours ago, Diego il Catanico Jr said:

This really does not make sense.

 

Anyway, the idea is good I think every weapon should be more complex.

Heavier/lighter rocks are incredibly different as far as timing goes.

 

I've got a slightly more in-depth explanation of the experience system in the works, but basically your total number of shots in a stroke with a sling type will give you a base experience modifier, and then the specific stone will have a separate modifier.

 

Simply put:

sling type exp, = 500 shots

stroke type exp. = 250 shots

stone type exp. = 500 shots

total exp = 1250 shots

 

Basically, every shot with a certain type of stone will improve your accuracy with it, every shot with a stroke will improve your accuracy with it, and every shot with a type of sling will improve your accuracy with that type of sling.

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Ok you're right.

But if we focus on the slings in this way, we have to focus on every weapon in this way. I would like that.

I will think about it only if people are interested.

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IMHO more complex weapons would be great and sling also sounds nice especially for a beginning of game when you can try fight with everything if you don't have another option and it is too late to run away - except darn skeletons.

Edited by Narmo
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8 hours ago, Narmo said:

IMHO more complex weapons would be great and sling also sounds nice especially for a beginning of game when you can try fight with everything if you don't have another option and it is too late to run away - except darn skeletons.

Yeah, I really love the weapon (So much so I EDC it) and you could do some really fun Roleplaying gameplay.

 

As an aside, the sling is known for being able to easily put down lions, bears, and other big cats (Shepherds would carry them for this reason) if you could hit it in the head, and I think that this should carry into TFC with a bit of balance.

 

The basic idea is the addition of bleeding (Which both piercing and slashing weapons can cause) and would only affect certain mobs (AKA zombies, skeletons, and spiders don't bleed, but orcs or whatever else you guys add as the mobs that make island progression difficult or something like that would bleed) and damage zones.

 

Bleeding from the head = non fatal

bleeding from the neck = fatal

bleeding from the chest = potentially fatal

bleeding from the extremities = non fatal

 

And, in the same way:

 

Crushing to the extremities = non fatal

crushing to the chest = potentially fatal

crushing to the neck = potentially fatal

crushing to the head = fatal

 

(If incapacitations were added, obviously crushing to the extremities would become VERY useful for putting a bear or similar out of commission before finishing them off with a spear/arrow/sword strike intended to cause bleedout.)

 

Anyway, just some basic thoughts there, Up to you devs what you want and don't, as always. 

 

And of course, thanks bioxx and kitty for my favorite MC mod ever!

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Crushing to the extremities = not fatal (less damage with armor), slowness or weakness/mining fatigue

Crushing to the chest = potentially fatal (reduced possibility with armor,less damage with armor)

Crushing to the neck* = potentially fatal

Crushing to the head = fatal (potentially fatal with armor,less damage with armor)


Slashing to the extremities = potentially fatal (reduced possibility with armor,less damage with armor), slowness or weakness/mining fatigue

Slashing to the chest = fatal (potentially fatal with armor,less damage with armor)

Slashing the neck* = fatal

Slashing to the head = fatal (potentially fatal with armor,less damage with armor)


Piercing to the extremities = not fatal (less damage with armor), slowness or weakness/mining fatigue

Piercing to the chest =  potentially fatal (reduced possibility with armor,less damage with armor)

Piercing the neck* = fatal

Piercing to the head = fatal (reduced possibility with armor,less damage with armor)


*The neck will be a 8x1x8 hitbox under the head, in the body

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