Terrain and biome generation

[PizzaSHARK! 13]

I know it's been said that terrain generation isn't finished, but I also haven't seen a list of things that are intended for future releases. So I'm hoping to both find out more about what the current plans are, and to also flesh out some possibilities with this thread.

First thing, we know mob generation and/or behavior is receiving changes in the future as well (specifics would be nice, if possible), specifically that both zombies and skeletons are supposed to being set to spawn only inside certain areas, like crypts, tombs, whatever. There's also been talk about changing creepers to spawn only around "creeper nests." We could probably fairly assume the same thing about spiders (only spawning around "spider webs" or whatever) though I'd assume all of this is subject to change at random and without notice. But I'm going to partly proceed on things like this staying MOSTLY the same.

Right now, exploration is kind of boring. There are no randomly generated structures of any type to find, and aside from hunting for a specific kind of tree or rock/ore, there isn't a lot of reason to explore beyond your home area.

So what kinds of structures would we want to see generated when Bioxx and his helpers are "done" with changes to terrain and biome generation?

Well, we'd obviously need structures for creeper nests, spider webs, and the tombs, crypts, barrows and whatnot our undead monsters would spawn in and around. In essence, these would be like dungeons in vMC, whether there's an actual monster spawner or a new block that basically functions like one.

Should these locations have loot in order to encourage players to seek them out and fight the monsters in order to get to the loot? How common should these monster homes be? How much loot, and what quality of loot should we be able to find? Completed tools? Completed metal ingots? Just chunks of ore? No metal of any kind?

What about if these locations contained very rare components that could be used to later craft an "enchanted" tool, weapon, or piece of armor, similar to Thaumcraft's special items like Axe of the Stream? Items that don't have an enchantment in the vMC sense, but have a special bonus effect or extra function. Being made from components rather than finding a completed item would also make these items valuable commodities for trade with other players.

What about vanilla loot that would otherwise be unobtainable? Things like vanilla cobble and stone bricks (and mossy versions of those), vanilla sandstone, and so on? What about dyes that are otherwise difficult or impossible to obtain in TFC right now?

But what about beyond converting vMC structures? What other kinds of things would we like to see randomly generated within a TFC world? Should Steve?'s world be pristine and untouched, or should he occasionally stumble across ruins left from a previous civilization?

And beyond that, what about changes you'd like to see to the "biome" system in TFC? Is it possible with TFC's system to have biomes spawn only when bordered by other biome types? Would it be possible to have a "high, snowy mountain" biome that can only spawn when it's bordered by, say, a mountainous forest biome type? Could we have deep "valley" biomes that can spawn only when bordered by mountainous biomes? What about a "river" biome that could produce an "estuary" or "delta" biome at one end? To avoid the taboo word, is it possible to have TFC's biome generation system be setup to generate Earth-like ecosystems that obey logical rules? It seems like the temperature system that's in play right now could be a beginning towards something like this, since it seems to prevent deserts from spawning right on top of snowy biomes.

Actually, on the subject - would it be possible to have cold deserts (biomes which have little water and have sand blocks instead of dirt blocks as the ground layer) where rare precipitation is snow rather than rain?

Tying it together (which is why this is in one thread and not two), is it possible to have structures generate only inside specific biome sets? Maybe creepers don't enjoy hot weather, and cold-blooded spiders can't handle colder biomes?

[achartran 465]

First off, biomes spawn according to z value, so the issue of a tundra biome next to a desert is gone. Cold is in the north and south and warm is in the middle, just like a real planet. It's not just the temperature that does this.

I really like the idea of new biomes, such as valleys and a proper river biome, but it has been suggested before.

Finally, Bioxx and Dunk generally don't tell us too much before they actually implement the feature and release it, it just isn't how it works around here. So getting clarification or specifics on any of those things is unlikely. With that in mind, its usually better to just get your suggestions out and not worry about what is already in the works.

But, I like some of your ideas here, some of them are already in the game, but others could be pretty cool.

(side note: I only support ruins and dungeons if they are done well, i don't think things like the VMC ruins/dungeons should come within 100 yards of tfc, in fact, we should put a restraining order on them.

[PizzaSHARK! 13]

I agree they don't make sense in TFC's manner of play but they added a lot to the act of exploration in vMC. Exploring in TFC rapidly becomes boring, though part of that might be the apparent lack of deserts and Bioxx mentioned snow isn't able to happen in the current versions. Just too much "generic forest," "generic plains," and "generic mountains."

[achartran 465]

well, it is a beta, problems are to be expected, and oh boy! do we have some problems. But they will get better, I'm sure snow will return and deserts will once again be completely useless, but still there.

[PizzaSHARK! 13]

well, it is a beta, problems are to be expected, and oh boy! do we have some problems. But they will get better, I'm sure snow will return and deserts will once again be completely useless, but still there.

Yeah, and they'll eventually become boring "generic desert," "generic tundra"

That's why I think it's important to have randomly generated "structures" in the game, to make exploration fun and even to give it a purpose beyond hunting for specific kinds of rock. What if you could only get certain kinds of vanilla block through loot chests in randomly generated structures, and those things could only generate in certain areas? Now you've got a REASON to scour every inch of that hot, dangerous desert or to chop your way through a dense jungle.

[achartran 465]

thing with randomly generated (playing devil's advocate here) is that, at least in minecraft, they always have some part that is half generated, missing, or it ends up just plain wonky.

[PizzaSHARK! 13]

thing with randomly generated (playing devil's advocate here) is that, at least in minecraft, they always have some part that is half generated, missing, or it ends up just plain wonky.

Probably because Notch isn't AtomicStryker and didn't know how to properly design a random structure spawning system

But yeah, I know what you mean.