Thoughts

[mrsharpie 0]

Hey guys,

After finally getting TFC to work (again, thanks to everyone for the help!), I've been happily playing for a few days now. I love the mod, and feel like it adds some much needed challenge to the game. I can honestly say I never thought making a pick would be a big achievement. First of all, before I go any further, I love this mod. Everything I say here is from the perspective of someone who wants to help make the mod even better than it already is. Now then, after playing a fair amount, I've noticed something. Something seems to be missing from vanilla minecraft, and that something is very simple; an overarching goal. So far there are little things, like make a pickaxe, make a suit of armor, get a nice house going. But I feel like we've almost gone back a step, to minecraft before the End came in. As somebody who's been playing minecraft for a long time, I can say that the addition of something to aim for was quite welcome. It gives you purpose. When playing the Xbox version, the only qualm I have is that I end up starting a new world every few times I play. I feel like it's kind of easy to run out of things to do. And the same is true in a sense about TFC, it just takes a helluva lot longer. So here's my suggestion. Give us a goal. Something that will test us. Something that is very hard to achieve, but will have huge payoffs. Something that we can wake up every morning and work towards, a little bit each day. It doesn't have to be the End, by any means. Frankly, the only thing that compels me to attempt to get to the end is the sense of purpose and the ridiculous amounts of xp. But, I would love something original, something that we could use as an overarching goal. I personally think it would make the whole experience a lot more interesting, and a lot more rewarding.

So, ideas? Let me know what you think!

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

Hey guys,

After finally getting TFC to work (again, thanks to everyone for the help!), I've been happily playing for a few days now. I love the mod, and feel like it adds some much needed challenge to the game. I can honestly say I never thought making a pick would be a big achievement. First of all, before I go any further, I love this mod. Everything I say here is from the perspective of someone who wants to help make the mod even better than it already is. Now then, after playing a fair amount, I've noticed something. Something seems to be missing from vanilla minecraft, and that something is very simple; an overarching goal. So far there are little things, like make a pickaxe, make a suit of armor, get a nice house going. But I feel like we've almost gone back a step, to minecraft before the End came in. As somebody who's been playing minecraft for a long time, I can say that the addition of something to aim for was quite welcome. It gives you purpose. When playing the Xbox version, the only qualm I have is that I end up starting a new world every few times I play. I feel like it's kind of easy to run out of things to do. And the same is true in a sense about TFC, it just takes a helluva lot longer. So here's my suggestion. Give us a goal. Something that will test us. Something that is very hard to achieve, but will have huge payoffs. Something that we can wake up every morning and work towards, a little bit each day. It doesn't have to be the End, by any means. Frankly, the only thing that compels me to attempt to get to the end is the sense of purpose and the ridiculous amounts of xp. But, I would love something original, something that we could use as an overarching goal. I personally think it would make the whole experience a lot more interesting, and a lot more rewarding.

So, ideas? Let me know what you think!

Allow me to keep this simple and attempt to be kind about it.

This is not a mod for short attention-span, ritalin-popping, x-box playing 'new generation' gamers who need a steady stream of violence, achievements, and the promise of a conclusive ending to keep them at their magic glowy game screens.

Minecraft did not have an ending for a very good reason, and the addition of The End was itself a step backward in the game's development, when they decided to make it instead of the promised skylands dimension.

I like to think that TFC is not just 'Survival mode as it should have been', but is rather Minecraft as it should have been. And the heart of minecraft is and has always been directionless fucking around, peppered with milestones and generally being constructive and imaginative. Endings are anathema to minecraft, and even the TFC reimagining of The End (as briefly and tentatively glossed over by Dunk) deals more with just being a death realm and less of an actual end to the whole game.

In brief, your idea may be perfectly fun and great for other things, but it does not fit in with TFC.

This is not the mod you're looking for. *jedi hand wave*

[antimattergizmo 41]

All right he we go!

I'm glad that you had a decent amount of text unlike many other one shot suggestions, but it was more of an American football play-offs speech. No ideas were put out to what this supposed goal would be. You should know from looking around a bit (the fact there is even a suggestion page) and seeing many things pointing to this being beta. The devs are working on things as hard and fast as they can, but it is certainly a process. I'm sure they have some form of goal after establishing yourself, but even that has only been in concept. There are tons more of things planned before even starting code for an end (if it will do so), heck there will be sub-goals up the wazoo (word of the week). For instance we are nearly entering the beta 2 agriculture update, which will most likely have its own goals in creating a farm that is watered right, spaced appropriately, and gets enough nutrients. After that (I think) is Kingdoms and construction and who knows what that will be filled with. What I'm saying is it shouldn't be worried about now as that will be far off if it is even an actual ending. An end to a game is the end of imagination within the game. Just remember Beta is Beta

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Allow me to keep this simple and attempt to be kind about it.

This is not a mod for short attention-span, ritalin-popping, x-box playing 'new generation' gamers who need a steady stream of violence, achievements, and the promise of a conclusive ending to keep them at their magic glowy game screens.

Minecraft did not have an ending for a very good reason, and the addition of The End was itself a step backward in the game's development, when they decided to make it instead of the promised skylands dimension.

I like to think that TFC is not just 'Survival mode as it should have been', but is rather Minecraft as it should have been. And the heart of minecraft is and has always been directionless fucking around, peppered with milestones and generally being constructive and imaginative. Endings are anathema to minecraft, and even the TFC reimagining of The End (as briefly and tentatively glossed over by Dunk) deals more with just being a death realm and less of an actual end to the whole game.

In brief, your idea may be perfectly fun and great for other things, but it does not fit in with TFC.

This is not the mod you're looking for. *jedi hand wave*

but I can't code without my Ritalin...

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

but I can't code without my Ritalin...

Back in your cage, you

[Jasnatdic 85]

but I can't code without my Ritalin...

Your allowed to code it on ritalin, but you can't play it.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Your allowed to code it on ritalin, but you can't play it.

With out the ritalin I can't focus enough to stay on task... I actually have ADHD.

[mrsharpie 0]

I'm not so much suggesting an end as I am just something work towards. Simply a goal. And as for ideas, I would tentatively say building an empire, possibly in a style of Tale of Kingdoms, but I know Bioxx is not sure about NPCs. I know something of this variety will be implemented in SMP, but for those of us who aren't as into massive servers, NPCs could be cool. Who knows, maybe Bioxx and TyberAlyx could cooperate on TFC to implement some of Tale of Kingdoms's features. I for one think that would be fucking awesome.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

I'm not so much suggesting an end as I am just something work towards. Simply a goal. And as for ideas, I would tentatively say building an empire, possibly in a style of Tale of Kingdoms, but I know Bioxx is not sure about NPCs. I know something of this variety will be implemented in SMP, but for those of us who aren't as into massive servers, NPCs could be cool. Who knows, maybe Bioxx and TyberAlyx could cooperate on TFC to implement some of Tale of Kingdoms's features. I for one think that would be fucking awesome.

Unfortunately, Bioxx and I don't like the "end" concept to a game. A lot of games are based on a story and have the classic plot structure with a beginning, a middle and an end. Minecraft doesn't follow the same story mechanic, and TFC does this to an even greater degree. MC/TFC seem more to simulate life or survival, which as you know isn't a small snippet of time, it is your entire existence. There is no nice closure, it's not "wrapped up" it just goes on and on until you die (figuratively). So you see, that is why this game has no "end", and why "the end" is being changed to represent death, as this marks the end of life.

[mrsharpie 0]

Exactly. The fact that the End was an actual end of the game wasn't my favorite either. Like I said though, it would be nice to have an objective. Meaningless fucking around was great for the first year, but even that gets a bit stale eventually. I just feel like there should at least be more things to do. I'm very excited about agriculture, as it adds another goal to the game. But now that i've said it, i'm liking the empire idea more and more...

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Exactly. The fact that the End was an actual end of the game wasn't my favorite either. Like I said though, it would be nice to have an objective. Meaningless fucking around was great for the first year, but even that gets a bit stale eventually. I just feel like there should at least be more things to do. I'm very excited about agriculture, as it adds another goal to the game. But now that i've said it, i'm liking the empire idea more and more...

Did you read past the first line? I said no end. There is no goal. No point. It just is. If you want a goal, Rogue and I have some ideas for some late game tech, so I guess you can aim to have as much fun industrializing your kingdom and working with the others on your server to build an ultimate project like a giant statue or something, but completely legitly, as you can. It gives everyone a job and a purpose and builds team work and trust or some shit.

So basically, aim to be as rich and powerful as you can, just like real life.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

Exactly. The fact that the End was an actual end of the game wasn't my favorite either. Like I said though, it would be nice to have an objective. Meaningless fucking around was great for the first year, but even that gets a bit stale eventually. I just feel like there should at least be more things to do. I'm very excited about agriculture, as it adds another goal to the game. But now that i've said it, i'm liking the empire idea more and more...

Minecraft is a game where you make up your own objectives

For further information, see

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/2680-Minecraft

[Arthur_Dent 36]

With out the ritalin I can't focus enough to stay on task... I actually have ADHD.

As a fellow ADHD sufferer, you have my condolences. it just sucks. The only time I could sit still and focus as a kid was playing pokemon yellow or reading. But ritalin was the worst. Made me groggy, unfocused, disinterested in everything, and actually made me physically ill. After years of couselling and self-moderation, I have it mostly under control, but if I sit still for long periods of time without something to focus on, to capture my thoughts, I get jittery and start thinking about doing "something" just for the sake of doing something. Lead to alot of trouble in the way back, but I now have a series of mental checkpoints I go through to stop meself from making an ass out of myself.

In short, Dunk, I feel your pain. ADHD sucks hardcore.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

As a fellow ADHD sufferer, you have my condolences. it just sucks. The only time I could sit still and focus as a kid was playing pokemon yellow or reading. But ritalin was the worst. Made me groggy, unfocused, disinterested in everything, and actually made me physically ill. After years of couselling and self-moderation, I have it mostly under control, but if I sit still for long periods of time without something to focus on, to capture my thoughts, I get jittery and start thinking about doing "something" just for the sake of doing something. Lead to alot of trouble in the way back, but I now have a series of mental checkpoints I go through to stop meself from making an ass out of myself.

In short, Dunk, I feel your pain. ADHD sucks hardcore.

Ritalin does make me feel nauseated to the point I can almost never eat a mid day meal, and it elevates my heart rate a bit, and it makes it so that caffeine in general makes me feel like crap (a few redbulls supposedly would put me in cardiac arrest), but it wakes me up in the morning without coffee, brightens my day a bit and allows me to focus for hours on a single task without stopping for anything (useful when coding lol). I remember when I was in the first grade, I was never able to sit during story time, i was always pacing the room and the first time I took ritalin, I sat and built lego with my Dad for 4 hours (I was about 6). It was so dramatic that we stuck with it.

[mrsharpie 0]

Well alright then. Guess not.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Well alright then. Guess not.

It's alright man, don't sweat it. Maybe TFC isn't the mod for you, but if you feel like sticking around, I'd be glad to see you make more suggestions, now that you know kinda where we want to take this mod.

[Arthur_Dent 36]

Ritalin does make me feel nauseated to the point I can almost never eat a mid day meal, and it elevates my heart rate a bit, and it makes it so that caffeine in general makes me feel like crap (a few redbulls supposedly would put me in cardiac arrest), but it wakes me up in the morning without coffee, brightens my day a bit and allows me to focus for hours on a single task without stopping for anything (useful when coding lol). I remember when I was in the first grade, I was never able to sit during story time, i was always pacing the room and the first time I took ritalin, I sat and built lego with my Dad for 4 hours (I was about 6). It was so dramatic that we stuck with it.

I stopped taking Ritalin in about the 3rd grade, and dude, it was like someone turned the world on high definition to me. Honestly, I think one of the reasons I started to behave so well was that I never wanted to feel like crap like that again, so I guess that's when I took up doing "projects", (legos, books, movies, little green army men) anything that I could force myself to focus on. It worked really well for me, too well, I think, cause aomethimes I get so focused on one single thing, that if someone interiors me and breaks my thought process, I am liable to bite their heads off. I don't like being interrupted when I'm trying to focus on not getting in trouble. To appease the teachers, I started basically a weaker type of Ritalin, though it wasn't Ritalin, but that only lasted a little over a half a year before my counsellors said I peaked (tried thinking of that word, means mountain with a large fla top, their found in the southwest, for the life of me I can't spell it!!!!) and wouldn't benefit from anymore meds. I've been med free ever since, and it can be hard to deal with sometimes, but how crappy I felt as a kid on the meds pops into my mind, and that negative reinforcement keeps me in check. I don't take the meds, so I guess my medicine is single-mindedly completing a task, be t legos or reading...

Which reminds me... I need to get a new Lego project to build...

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

I stopped taking Ritalin in about the 3rd grade, and dude, it was like someone turned the world on high definition to me. Honestly, I think one of the reasons I started to behave so well was that I never wanted to feel like crap like that again, so I guess that's when I took up doing "projects", (legos, books, movies, little green army men) anything that I could force myself to focus on. It worked really well for me, too well, I think, cause aomethimes I get so focused on one single thing, that if someone interiors me and breaks my thought process, I am liable to bite their heads off. I don't like being interrupted when I'm trying to focus on not getting in trouble. To appease the teachers, I started basically a weaker type of Ritalin, though it wasn't Ritalin, but that only lasted a little over a half a year before my counsellors said I peaked (tried thinking of that word, means mountain with a large fla top, their found in the southwest, for the life of me I can't spell it!!!!) and wouldn't benefit from anymore meds. I've been med free ever since, and it can be hard to deal with sometimes, but how crappy I felt as a kid on the meds pops into my mind, and that negative reinforcement keeps me in check. I don't take the meds, so I guess my medicine is single-mindedly completing a task, be t legos or reading...

Which reminds me... I need to get a new Lego project to build...

plateau? Days when I don't need to do any work I don't take the ritalin, but my appetite skyrockets when I don't take it, so there's that too. I've never experienced the "high definition" effect when off of it, but I feel like being on it helps me more. From what i understand of how ADHD works, it's a lack of the chemical in your brain that makes you interested, essentially, you couldn't care less. The ritalin either is this chemical or helps you produce this chemical so that you don't have to, and when I'm on it, I can't get bored. Litterally, I remember back in highschool we were watching a movie and all around me people were complaining that it was too boring (it was a movie from the 50's I think), but I realized that I wasn't bored, I could just sit and watch. It wasn't because I was enjoying myself, I knew I should have been bored but I wasn't, so for me it's a handy tool. I can sit through or read just about anything when I'm on my meds lol.

[Arthur_Dent 36]

plateau? Days when I don't need to do any work I don't take the ritalin, but my appetite skyrockets when I don't take it, so there's that too. I've never experienced the "high definition" effect when off of it, but I feel like being on it helps me more. From what i understand of how ADHD works, it's a lack of the chemical in your brain that makes you interested, essentially, you couldn't care less. The ritalin either is this chemical or helps you produce this chemical so that you don't have to, and when I'm on it, I can't get bored. Litterally, I remember back in highschool we were watching a movie and all around me people were complaining that it was too boring (it was a movie from the 50's I think), but I realized that I wasn't bored, I could just sit and watch. It wasn't because I was enjoying myself, I knew I should have been bored but I wasn't, so for me it's a handy tool. I can sit through or read just about anything when I'm on my meds lol.

Plateau, flabber nuggets, how could I forget that?!?

Anyway, what the docs told me that my type of ADHD was were I was too interested in everything, or something like that... Maybe it was the bored or everything thing... All I remember was that I was constantly looking for something to fully engage me, to immerse myself into. I didn't /want/ to be acting out, I wanted to be a normal kid, so I kept searching for something to engage me. Sometimes I went between 5 things in a loop, hopping from one to the next.

The "HD" thing to me was like someone pulled the wool off my eyes. I guess when I was on the medicine, I was so focused on how I felt, my heartbeat and various aches the medicine gave me, that I never got to fully experience everything, like my attention was split between the two and not really paying attention to either. Once the meds were gone, it was like I could focus my attention better... Kind of ironic that a medicine that's supposed to make me interested and focused made me uninterested and unfocused, instead, uh?

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Plateau, flabber nuggets, how could I forget that?!?

Anyway, what the docs told me that my type of ADHD was were I was too interested in everything, or something like that... Maybe it was the bored or everything thing... All I remember was that I was constantly looking for something to fully engage me, to immerse myself into. I didn't /want/ to be acting out, I wanted to be a normal kid, so I kept searching for something to engage me. Sometimes I went between 5 things in a loop, hopping from one to the next.

The "HD" thing to me was like someone pulled the wool off my eyes. I guess when I was on the medicine, I was so focused on how I felt, my heartbeat and various aches the medicine gave me, that I never got to fully experience everything, like my attention was split between the two and not really paying attention to either. Once the meds were gone, it was like I could focus my attention better... Kind of ironic that a medicine that's supposed to make me interested and focused made me uninterested and unfocused, instead, uh?

I guess everyone experiences it differently. From what i understand, when the mind can't produce enough of the "interest" chemical, it tries to be interested in everything, and what would over stimulate another person's brain manages to produce just enough of the chemical to keep us sane lol. That's why our attention can't be kept for more than a second or two, because we need a constant influx of events and actions to keep us going.

[Arthur_Dent 36]

I guess everyone experiences it differently. From what i understand, when the mind can't produce enough of the "interest" chemical, it tries to be interested in everything, and what would over stimulate another person's brain manages to produce just enough of the chemical to keep us sane lol. That's why our attention can't be kept for more than a second or two, because we need a constant influx of events and actions to keep us going.

Lol, I guess I've forced mine to make what I need without overstimulating myself. But yeah, I meet people all over the place with ADHD, and all of them have different stories about what it does to them. One story, millions of ways to tell it, I guess...

Also explains why I can multi task decently, and my preference for background noise whenever I do something.

[Scooterdanny 285]

My solution to my adhd? constatly having someone to talk to, or have some nice nox arcana in the background. I turned away from using the medicines as they had adverse affects on my perception of the world (like pulling my own hair out bad) So i seem to cope, sadly my posts will never reach something like what Jed writes, because of it lol.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

My solution to my adhd? constatly having someone to talk to, or have some nice nox arcana in the background. I turned away from using the medicines as they had adverse affects on my perception of the world (like pulling my own hair out bad) So i seem to cope, sadly my posts will never reach something like what Jed writes, because of it lol.

Other people listen to Nox Arcana?

Holy shit

[Arthur_Dent 36]

My solution to my adhd? constatly having someone to talk to, or have some nice nox arcana in the background. I turned away from using the medicines as they had adverse affects on my perception of the world (like pulling my own hair out bad) So i seem to cope, sadly my posts will never reach something like what Jed writes, because of it lol.

Holy crap, don't get me started on the "adverse affects"... Again, it was enough negitive reinforcement to make me not want to act out. And yeah, having a friend to talk with really helped.

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Wow, I sure am glad that meds don't mess with me that much, lol.