Direct use of all metals for tools etc

[Srgnoodles 1,030]

I don't really get why, the metric system seems to be so much simpler... However, that's probably because i don't know any other system :/

because Americans will be Americans, they have to be different from anyone else, even if it means using a terrible system of measurement

[Rgamer 44]

because Americans will be Americans, they have to be different from anyone else, even if it means using a terrible system of measurement

Israeli dual citizenship FTW.... even if it means I will have to pay US income taxes on income I earn in Israel.

[Azdoine 218]

I'm an American, and I only use imperial when I'm dealing with other people and have no choice.

Metric is my default.

Seriously, this is like a fucking toothache. The longer america puts off fixing it, the worse it's going to get.

[Rgamer 44]

I'm an American, and I only use imperial when I'm dealing with other people and have no choice.

Metric is my default.

Seriously, this is like a fucking toothache. The longer america puts off fixing it, the worse it's going to get.

Dude, Congress can't even agree to spend less money than it takes in in taxes. Do you seriously think that same Congress will ever switch to a metric system.

Also, to be fair, we use the metric system in limited instances -e.x. soda is sold in 2L bottles, most people are familiar with the meter and centimeter. Most. I am somewhat biased, most of the people I know are in high-level math and science classes.

[Azdoine 218]

I vote we educate the public on the difference, and let people make the decision as individuals.

Politicians deserve to be stuck with the imperial system.

[Rgamer 44]

I vote we educate the public on the difference, and let people make the decision as individuals.

Politicians deserve to be stuck with the imperial system.

As a libertarian, I wholeheartedly support this. Screw politicians. All of them.

[Azdoine 218]

One third of an imperial recipe:

***

One ninth of a cup of milk.

One sixth of a teaspoon of sprinkles.

19 tablespoons of fast food.

***

One third of a metric recipe:

***

33 grams of flour.

65 milliliters of mustard.

One liter of tea.

***

Given basic equipment you might find in someones kitchen, which sounds easier to measure out?

[Rgamer 44]

Fairer comparison:

1/9 cup of milk

8 ounces of flour

4 ounces of sugar

**

26.2 mL milk

226.2 g flour

113.1 g sugar

***

Did not mean that to happen w/ flour and milk.... (Metric is still easier.... for the most part. Masses are equally easy, as long as you have a digital scale or weights.)

Also (hope this works...)

We are ENGINEERS! And we solve problems.

[Azdoine 218]

The issue is, imperial isn't consistent.

Instead of having one small unit multiplied by any number, it has one big unit that gets divided up by weird prime numbers. Yes, because it's easy to measure out one third of a cup without a dedicated measuring cup.

Why twelve inches, anyways?

[Rgamer 44]

The issue is, imperial isn't consistent.

Instead of having one small unit multiplied by any number, it has one big unit that gets divided up by weird prime numbers. Yes, because it's easy to measure out one third of a cup without a dedicated measuring cup.

Why twelve inches, anyways?

I didn't say I liked Imperial, but it's here for the forseeable future.

As for the twelve inches, I think it's the foot divided by the number of major lords? I could be wrong. (By the way, base-12 has all sorts of fascinating advantages over base-10. I won't go into them here.)

[Azdoine 218]

12 has more factors. The problem is, base ten is universal throughout the world.

We don't have much choice about that.

[Carthang 11]

One third of an imperial recipe:

***

One ninth of a cup of milk.

One sixth of a teaspoon of sprinkles.

19 tablespoons of fast food.

***

One third of a metric recipe:

***

33 grams of flour.

65 milliliters of mustard.

One liter of tea.

***

Given basic equipment you might find in someones kitchen, which sounds easier to measure out?

First thing first, how on earth is one ninth of a cup or one sixth of a teaspoon considered easy? =P

As for the second one, well, 33grams of flour would be approximately 1/2 dl, depending on which kind of flour you are using(the wheat flour I have at home is approximately 60grams/dl. Regardless of what flour is being used, it should give approximate values in the bag). 65ml would be 0.65 or around 2/3 dl. Usually a kitchen that uses these kinds of measurements will have one for a liter as well, if not, 10 dl will work just as fine.

Generally, grams(or for larger quantities kilograms) tend to be used for meat and vegetables when cooking, and things that come in prepacked/standard sizes, such as a bar of chocolate or a certain amount of butter. For anything that needs to be measured on the spot(flour, sugar etc.), deciliter(100ml), tablespoon(15ml), teaspoon(5ml) and a very small one that is 1ml are used. It's called "Kryddmått" in swedish, which translates into "one milliliter measuring spoon" apparently, who would've guessed. =P

Generally recipes are tailored towards the region where it is published, though converting recipes between different measurements can be a real headache at times, trust me.

And to make matters more interesting, did you guys know that american tablespoons and teaspoons are slightly less than 15ml and 5ml each? Not smaller by much, but still smaller. =P

As a final note, how did this topic go from discussing metal tools and armor into a discussion on imperial measurements? =P

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

Fairer comparison:

1/9 cup of milk

8 ounces of flour

4 ounces of sugar

**

26.2 mL milk

226.2 g flour

113.1 g sugar

***

Did not mean that to happen w/ flour and milk.... (Metric is still easier.... for the most part. Masses are equally easy, as long as you have a digital scale or weights.)

Also (hope this works...)

We are ENGINEERS! And we solve problems.

Personally I prefer to take 3-digit measurements (200 g for example) and upconvert them into decimals (.2 kg, in that instance)

Given that you'd probably have a set of tools for measuring both centimeters and meters, I see no reason to count 300 centimeters when I could just pull out a meter stick, go up to .3 of it, and go 'yup that's 300cm'

[Rgamer 44]

-snip-

As a final note, how did this topic go from discussing metal tools and armor into a discussion on imperial measurements? =P

Good question. Welcome to the derailment ability of this forum.

[Carthang 11]

Personally I prefer to take 3-digit measurements (200 g for example) and upconvert them into decimals (.2 kg, in that instance)

Given that you'd probably have a set of tools for measuring both centimeters and meters, I see no reason to count 300 centimeters when I could just pull out a meter stick, go up to .3 of it, and go 'yup that's 300cm'

.3 of a meter should be 30cm, just wanted to point out that little typo. =P

If it's 300cm it would be 3 meter sticks. =D

Good question. Welcome to the derailment ability of this forum.

I've already become familiar with the concept methinks. I went to sleep one night, and the next day I saw a topic filled with ponies, and I clearly remember following that topic for other reasons. xD

[Rgamer 44]

Also, apologies about double post, but....

Personally I prefer to take 3-digit measurements (200 g for example) and upconvert them into decimals (.2 kg, in that instance)

Given that you'd probably have a set of tools for measuring both centimeters and meters, I see no reason to count 300 centimeters when I could just pull out a meter stick, go up to .3 of it, and go 'yup that's 300cm'

I put that "recipe" up for a comparison of the same recipe in Imperial and Metric. Naturally, I would use kg for almost everything, seeing as this is not a biotech lab, where lots of something is "grams and grams and grams" Poor tonal synthesis guys...

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

.3 of a meter should be 30cm, just wanted to point out that little typo. =P

If it's 300cm it would be 3 meter sticks. =D

I've already become familiar with the concept methinks. I went to sleep one night, and the next day I saw a topic filled with ponies, and I clearly remember following that topic for other reasons. xD

gack

meant mm

300 mm

sorry, in my field I'm not much used to working with prefixes of a higher order than milli or micro

[Rgamer 44]

gack

meant mm

300 mm

sorry, in my field I'm not much used to working with prefixes of a higher order than milli or micro

Biotech lab?

[Draco18s 46]

chainmail is better against crushing cause its flexible but peircing attacks can break through the links, also provides less defence than plate

AUURGGHH!

*The sound of a thousand history teachers dying*

So, so very wrong!

Chain mail is horrible at deflecting blunt blows precisely because it bends so easily! None of the energy is blocked. Against plate mail, the same blow would bounce right off.

Meanwhile, the crossbow was invented and perfected primarily for its use in piercing through plate armor. Against chain, however, it's neigh on useless, because the barbbed point gets caught in the links, and it's energy is spread across a wide area.

Mail armour provided an effective defence against slashing blows by an edged weapon and penetration by thrusting and piercing weapons; in fact a study conducted at the Royal Armouries at Leeds concluded that "it is almost impossible to penetrate using any conventional medieval weapon."

Fluted plate was not only decorative, but also reinforced the plate against bending under slashing or blunt impact. This offsets against the tendency for flutes to catch piercing blows.

Mounted knights armed with lances proved ineffective against formations of pikemen combined with crossbowmen whose weapons could penetrate most knights' armor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chainmail

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Plate_armor

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crossbow

[Rgamer 44]

AUURGGHH!

*The sound of a thousand history teachers dying*

So, so very wrong!

Chain mail is horrible at deflecting blunt blows precisely because it bends so easily! None of the energy is blocked. Against plate mail, the same blow would bounce right off.

Meanwhile, the crossbow was invented and perfected primarily for its use in piercing through plate armor. Against chain, however, it's neigh on useless, because the barbbed point gets caught in the links, and it's energy is spread across a wide area.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chainmail

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Plate_armor

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crossbow

Actually, chainmail really comes into its own against sharp things when padding is worn under it, so the chain converts the edged impact into a blunt one, and the padding lessens the blunt impact, and hence the injury. Warhammers were developed to simply ignore plate, which is awful against blunt impacts because it transmits the force, without absorbing very much at all. Thank you, DF forums.

Also, I point to the perfect medieval anti-armor weapon : the English Longbow.

[Draco18s 46]

Actually, chainmail really comes into its own against sharp things when padding is worn under it, so the chain converts the edged impact into a blunt one, and the padding lessens the blunt impact, and hence the injury. Warhammers were developed to simply ignore plate, which is awful against blunt impacts because it transmits the force, without absorbing very much at all. Thank you, DF forums.

Also, I point to the perfect medieval anti-armor weapon : the English Longbow.

Yes, there are subversions to both of the generic statements I made, however, generally speaking I was correct.

And the reason cloth + chain works against edged impacts is that it converts the tiny impact area into a larger one, so the overall force is spread out (which is blunt, but as an edged weapon uses less total force than a blunt weapon, this is a good thing).

Also, War Hammers are piercing weapons.

[Srgnoodles 1,030]

Also, War Hammers are piercing weapons.

well now we're getting into the combined weapon damages

because pretty much all weapons that you swing have some manner of crushing damage, seeing as you need a strong force, even with a sharp sword, to cut through things, but then again swords could also be used as peircing weapons if you stab with them

really, a warhammer or mace, even if spiked, is still effectively a crushing weapon, seeing as it's still a large chunk of metal on a long pole that you swing at people,

so damage type determining is less what the weapon has in it, and more of how it's used to fight

[Jasnatdic 85]

Hey, us Americans like our quirks Besides, the scientist-engineer segment of the population is quite comfortable with metric. Blame the rest of the idiots. Yeah, I'm an engineer. Well, studying to be one.

So everyone in America who either isn't a scientist or engineer, or doesn't use metric as their mesurement system is an idiot?

Well, its good to have these things cleared up. Silly me, here I thought it was because when your driving dow the highway it say tp miles to such and such city and not kilometers.

Dispite what a buch of superiority complex self proclaimed "smart" people think, the reason we use imperial is because it is the standard. If the government switched the system, all the signs, all the teaching to be metric it wouldn't be but a few years until it was just used by default.

By the way, Einstein wasn't a Dr. or a scientist or an engineer, and I bet he would smart person all of you into a headach. Might want to get off thinking a title makes you superior other than haveing the specific knowledge it has provided you.

[Srgnoodles 1,030]

So everyone in America who either isn't a scientist or engineer, or doesn't use metric as their mesurement system is an idiot?

Well, its good to have these things cleared up. Silly me, here I thought it was because when your driving dow the highway it say tp miles to such and such city and not kilometers.

Dispite what a buch of superiority complex self proclaimed "smart" people think, the reason we use imperial is because it is the standard. If the government switched the system, all the signs, all the teaching to be metric it wouldn't be but a few years until it was just used by default.

By the way, Einstein wasn't a Dr. or a scientist or an engineer, and I bet he would smart person all of you into a headach. Might want to get off thinking a title makes you superior other than haveing the specific knowledge it has provided you.

yes i know America doesnt use metric and all their stuff is in the imperial system. and i definitely think they should change this

metric just makes so much more sence you just multiply or devide by 10 to get to the next level

its much better than 12 in = 1 foot 3 feet = 1 yard and then theres this ginourmous gap between a foot and a mile which is this random 5280 feet, it just doesnt make any kind of sence

and btw, we werent calling you specifically an idiot for not using metric, we're reffering to America in general continuing to keep Imperial as the standard

[Jasnatdic 85]

and btw, we werent calling you specifically an idiot for not using metric, we're reffering to America in general continuing to keep Imperial as the standard

Didn't say I didn't understand or use metric, was just replying to the apperent thought in this thread that if you don't use metric you must have a low IQ. In the end the biggest reason they don't just jump from imperial to metric is money. It would probably cost in the range of a trillion dollers at this point to change everything that is relied on to be metric. When you have the extreme left and the extreme right flapping in opposite directions all the time its hard to get everything else to stop spinning long enough to balance a budget let alone build a plan to change something as integrated as an entire measurement system.

Becides, we can't have school children learning a method that a 5 year old can understand (metric) have to have a reason to keep them in school till their 18 and destroy all of their innovative thinking and immagination.