agriculture: possible adjustments & suggestions to consider.

[deus_hominem 12]

I usually try to let devs speak for themselves on what they want. A suggestion is a suggestion at face value. An argument which consists of someone else's opinion - however likely you might believe it to be true - is not an argument. I think it's a perfectly adequate solution to a problem. That doesn't mean that it will be used. I simply think that it is better than nothing. Which is currently where we are with this thread.

Until redstone is removed, or officially announced to be pending removal, this is irrelevant. Bioxx and Dunk have expressed their dislike of Redstone, that's not new and linking to it doesn't change anything. The fact is that they worked Redstone into the mod when they didn't have to. There is nothing about TFC that relies on redstone being available, and yet they went out of their way to put it in anyway. I won't make assumptions about why they did this, or whether anything is going to change. It isn't shortsighted to work with what is there. The fact is that Redstone was deliberately put into the mod when mod's worldgen itself eliminated redstone from naturally occurring. The assumption is that it won't be there later. What is shortsighted, is to dismiss ideas because of things that may or may not change, things which you personally have no control over, and yet posit with an air of preternatural certainty. They don't like redstone. That doesn't mean that it won't stay, it likely means that it won't remain in its current form; it might mean that it might undergo an overhaul to make it more believable. Or they may remove it in favor of a totally different system that provide similar functionality.

Obviously the suggestion is contingent on Redstone remaining. That is fine. I am fine with that contingency. You aren't.

Let the devs decide for themselves what they want to do, it's not your job to speak on their behalf and interpret every fragment of an idea for a grand plan. I've seen plenty of times where people have deigned to speak on Dunk's behalf because of a fragment of a sentence he wrote somewhere, and been told summarily that they were wrong. For example, Dunk has corrected people several times now about making assumptions about the 'technology level' of the mod, and yet people still use that as an argument for why X shouldn't be there. It's a bad argument, and speaking for someone else is bad form.

People do it alllll the time here, it drives me nuts. =P I'm not sure why Dunk doesn't smack people for it.

Regardless, obviously Redstone has been talked to death and beaten afterword, so let's move on as you suggest.

Quicklime is created by smelting calcium rich ore such as limestone. When heated (a lot), quicklime creates a very bright and persistent light that has been used to light theater stages. It is also useful because quicklime has many uses, such as in the creation of cement - something else I would very much like to see implemented in TFC. I like materials with multiple purposes.

Fungus is also fine, I have no issue with that. I think there is room for a variety of solutions.

ow you made my brain hurt... but in a good way!

[Biodigious 211]

I know I've heard people say that Bioxx has stated he will not implement guns for reasons that the mod does not encompass that specific time period.

With dunk talking about steam power, the mod's time period would progress into Earth's early 1600s-early 1700s.

[dockwithme 76]

Ughh...

I usually try to let devs speak for themselves on what they want. A suggestion is a suggestion at face value. An argument which consists of someone else's opinion - however likely you might believe it to be true - is not an argument. I think it's a perfectly adequate solution to a problem. That doesn't mean that it will be used. I simply think that it is better than nothing. Which is currently where we are with this thread.

Well, I see you have stated your opinion on THE REST OF THE SUGGESTIONS IN THIS THREAD being no good. You think redstone is a perfectly adequate solution? And chastise me for stating it doesn't follow the plan that has become apparent BY the devs? So however likely you might believe it to be true, your redstone argument is not an argument, just your opinion as well.

Until redstone is removed, or officially announced to be pending removal, this is irrelevant. Bioxx and Dunk have expressed their dislike of Redstone, that's not new and linking to it doesn't change anything. The fact is that they worked Redstone into the mod when they didn't have to. There is nothing about TFC that relies on redstone being available, and yet they went out of their way to put it in anyway. I won't make assumptions about why they did this, or whether anything is going to change. It isn't shortsighted to work with what is there. The fact is that Redstone was deliberately put into the mod when mod's worldgen itself eliminated redstone from naturally occurring. The assumption is that it won't be there later. What is shortsighted, is to dismiss ideas because of things that may or may not change, things which you personally have no control over, and yet posit with an air of preternatural certainty. They don't like redstone. That doesn't mean that it won't stay, it likely means that it won't remain in its current form; it might mean that it might undergo an overhaul to make it more believable. Or they may remove it in favor of a totally different system that provide similar functionality.

So your saying - don't base anything in these forums on what the devs have said. Their opinions and statements mean nothing - just hot air. So let's all suggest crazy things, without comparing it to the goal of the mod and direction is headed in. Smart.

Obviously the suggestion is contingent on Redstone remaining. That is fine. I am fine with that contingency. You aren't.

I don't mind what people suggest. I stated my thoughts on the suggestion. MY OPINION is that redstone has no place in this mod. It is not real and does not depict a believable process in the real world. I added the comments from devs as source for their (and my) opinion on it. Could it stay? Golly, I guess so. I highly doubt it, and if it did I'm sure it won't be named the same, work the same, or be produced exactly the same.

Let the devs decide for themselves what they want to do, it's not your job to speak on their behalf and interpret every fragment of an idea for a grand plan. I've seen plenty of times where people have deigned to speak on Dunk's behalf because of a fragment of a sentence he wrote somewhere, and been told summarily that they were wrong. For example, Dunk has corrected people several times now about making assumptions about the 'technology level' of the mod, and yet people still use that as an argument for why X shouldn't be there. It's a bad argument, and speaking for someone else is bad form.

Well you made me look like an ass in this whole post, thanks. Dunk may have made corrections on ASSUMPTIONS. I am taking sources from all over these forums and using them to make an educated guess on the likelihood and plausibility of suggestions. I would rather not spin our wheels in the mud with something that the devs have stated multiple times as being 'dumb,' 'stupid,' and that they 'don't like.' So sorry for trying to be productive here, and sorry if I hurt feelings. You're telling me not to have discipline with suggestions, and that's wrong. This is suggestions forum, yes, and I was merely offering my knowledge and opinion on the subject. So I'm glad I've been made an example of now, and hope you run around the forums and smack down anyone else who does the same. Thanks.

Quicklime is created by smelting calcium rich ore such as limestone. When heated (a lot), quicklime creates a very bright and persistent light that has been used to light theater stages. It is also useful because quicklime has many uses, such as in the creation of cement - something else I would very much like to see implemented in TFC. I like materials with multiple purposes.

Fungus is also fine, I have no issue with that. I think there is room for a variety of solutions.

Now this seems like something good. It is based on something real, and something we also already have in game. Do we pour the quicklime on a rock surface and light? Or do we have containers for it? This seems cool, and I wonder about the time mechanic of it. Does it burn for one who in-game day?

[transcengopher 349]

With dunk talking about steam power, the mod's time period would progress into Earth's early 1600s-early 1700s.

All Dunk was talking about is no more than speculations in speculations thread. I wouldn't take it as anything to go by until there's something about it in change-log.

[Biodigious 211]

All I was talking about is that dunk is talking of things that didn't happen until Earth's early 1600s-early 1700s.

[deus_hominem 12]

i think this post has gotten out of sync with the idea at hand. i was trying to spur ideas to make what i was seeing in my head possible, if need be i WILL make vanilla examples and show people why i want what i want. and from there i would love it if people would think of ways to make that coherent with the way tfc now works.

that or i would LOVE it if people would think of things that could be substituted in the stead of my ideals for something that might end up being better. now i've seen and heard about the fungus idea and ya know a mycelium (sp?) lay out would be nice, however with out silk touch it would be impossible. so maybe with some shrooms one could make a fungus growth and grow it over blocks, such as any cobble, or dirt. or maybe just dirt. then from there we could make a new kind of fungus like more tree like ones, or some little nobby bush like ones. i mean the ideas are endless.

personally i love that tinted glass idea. it would make clubs look epic, and could offer a possible way to "infuse" a specific spectrum of light into a situation where it called for it. some say illogical, well if i can put a torch up a pumpkin's ass and call it an endless underwater lantern, then fuck your logic i say. pardon my english please.

now can we please get back on the idea at hand here please? i mean i love the thorough talk and debating we have all had. and if we could keep it as civil as possible that would completely enthrall me with excitement. i want to think of ideas that dunk or bioxx could speak over their respective teams with and say; "wow this is pretty damn cool why didnt we think of it? well lets try. and if it fails then we can try to tweak it or replace it with a better idea." (ie: flint tools with the later replacement of knapped stone tools)