My Dream Game

[renadi 258]

So I've been just thinking about the perfect game for me for a while, as examples of the best games for me I'd put Demon's/Dark Souls, Haven and Hearth, Star Wars Galaxies(the beginning ages), EVE online, and apparently, Minecraft and more specifically Civraft and TFC.

There are a couple things I think of as important, primary would a dynamic world, in most games even the MMO's which I'd assume would be the ones where this would be such a big drive the players can usually do almost literally nothing to effect the world. In my opinion they might as easily just have an arcade structure if all the rooms are always going to reset and it's impossible to change anything outside of your own character.

Another thing I think as important and likely secondary to the first is the feeling of weakness. I think most decent games at the beginning make you feel incapable, slightly overwhelmed, just shy of doomed to failure, unless you get better. That progression from weakness to strength is what gives it meaning. Sometimes it's fun to play as the all powerful super soldier, able to take bullets, fireballs, swords, staves, etc.. to the body for hours on end, but that is rarely what I'm looking for. Or at least, not from the moment I start the game.

On top of that is persistence. Not that the whole world never changes but that any changes made don't just magically unhappen, or for that matter happen without justification like respawning in most MMO's.

Basically I find satisfaction in change, progress, growth. But I don't particularly want it to be quick, I'm OK with grinding personally, so long as you can witness progress.

I think that working with systems vs straight content creation is the smart way to go, make a world, throw people in it, so long as things bounce around you've got something good.

I think a game where not everybody(or even very few people) are expected to reach the highest levels is just fine.

Specific Ideas I Had(which are likely interdependent) and Want Feedback On:

Death:

The first thing I think is important for what I want is a sense of consequences, but also growth and progress. I like many roguelikes featuring permadeath simply because the characters that do die feel significant, however when playing with others things like this would be more of an annoyance than anything. One solution I may have thought of is only being able to respawn at certain points(or completely randomly). But instead of Minecraft's magic beds have a system where a structure has to be built, enchanted, and bound to. -(Tangent)- I like the idea of using some kind of spiritual energy like a currency in the world, most of the fantastical things that happen wouldn't be the results of ancient mages who have powers beyond our modern comprehension but the players. Magic items would NOT be just everywhere-(/Tangent)-

These structures, however they function would not simply be a set item that is built, but a template which is then built unique, with some characteristics standard and others optional, and some with a variety of options or configurations. Perhaps the system could be enhanced to provide other effects, similar to Minecraft's beacons(which is an idea I'd been hoping for for a while before they existed, with more options[support for teams, which may in fact becoming, in particular]). Essentially it would serve as a touchstone for a community, players would have to bind to it(unless public) by being close and touching it as well as paying a(spiritual/magical) fee. There would likely be a need for upkeep on it as well, perhaps it has a well of energy which is filled up by pouring energy in and used very slowly over time and in chunks when one actually needs to revive there.

Basically I'll be going downhill now from death, to simply injury.

Injury:

My idea about health is, in general, an HP system is at best a major compromise, one that may very well be necessary. I'd like real world injuries to accumulate unless treated, instead of just constantly taking HP damage with attacks you be more likely to suffer some injury(certain injury rates change based on armour), though some form of HP might be necessary, I think there should be a separation between lethal and non-lethal damage. The idea that one could have multiple injuries to different body parts with various effects(bleeding leg-damage when walking/running, broken leg-damage when bleeding running/slower speed, same for arms) There could be a couple ways this could be done, I prefer if they accumulate naturally, persist through death and quickly add up, however it may be more playable to have them only accumulate upon death, perhaps one injury each time. Either way I'd like a healing system to go with it. Some injuries heal quickly, some heal after a long time, and some diminish to a point but will leave a reminder on your body until properly healed.

I would like the different types of injury to have different methods of curing. Cuts would heal relatively quickly with little chance of permanent damage but if treated with salves, bandages or both it would decrease the healing time and minimize the damage. Likewise broken bones could be set(removing the damage component, but keeping the slowness) encouraging them to heal faster and without permanent harm. I should add, permanent harm would be possible to be healed as well, however it may take a more powerful potion or magic or something I'm honestly not so sure.

And from here we'll be leading into the potion system as I imagine it.

Potions:

My inspiration for potions was literally 100% copying Minecraft. But not what ended up being the potions system in Minecraft but the experimental system which in my opinion was MUCH better.

The basics of the system as it was was, and please excuse the failure of my math that may come out here, for every potion there was a certain value, I'm nut sure how high it went but let's just say it was 16 bits(seems low, the brain is iffy right now), basically each piece of this could have a value which would determine the effect, potency, COLOUR, and durations of a potion.

Let's use for example the first two bits determine if a potion will be one of 4 names, two for color, the next 4 determine what effect it has(1 for each effect) while the next 8 are for durations/potency. Instead of having obvious potion items adding an ingredient in would perform some kind of function to those 16 bits. Examples would be adding Fermented Spider Eyes turns bit 4 on, bit 4 is in the section for colour so alone let's say it turns the potion grey and has no other effect, but spider eyes have the effect of flipping bits 4 and 2, so if our potion was already grey it would revert to whatever it was before, and it's name would be changed to corespond to whatever the new name section says. Then Magma Cream added to a potion would flip bits 4 and 6, turn on 5, turn off 3, and then shift everything down one so we'd go from 0 0 | 0 0 | 0 0 0 0 | 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 to 0 0 | 0 1 | 1 1 0 0 | 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 and then to 0 0 | 0 0 | 1 1 1 0 | 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 resulting in the default name, colour, 3 effect with standard duration/potency. That effect would be the more common type, instead of a simple easy to predict add {strength ingredient} get strength potion one would have to experiment. It sounds unintuitive from the inside of it, but the result wasn't nearly so bad, trends would become apparent and it was actually pretty easy to learn how to get desired effects, not for everyone, but not too difficult if one did want to learn.

This system could easily be expanded to provide a number of other things I think would make for a fun game. For example if we're using Vanilla Minecraft as an example after each brewing cycle at the stand the water level could drop, and a new effect could be added based on the last ingredient. Because of this system the order of ingredients can matter(in the original water counted as an ingredient). If one wanted they could add ingredients until the potion was nearly powder and let it sit to actually make medicines that would be ingested in that form, or that could be stored and reconstituted with water to drink as potions later on. I'm honestly not 100% about how one would make a salve but I'd imagine one could powder and then add fat or wax? Instead of just minecraft effects we would also have effects to lessen, help heal or alleviate completely the injuries you could accumulate. You could then apply these to a bandage for an even better effect, or longer lasting.

Next topic has nothing to do with that other stuff!

Transport/Building:

I lumped these together, not sure if I should have, but either way, onward! Basically the huge draw of minecraft is the fully destructible environment, but it's only made me realize I want so much more. I like the new weight limits in TFC, and there was even another mod I tried where they were much more strict, it absolutely shifted the game, in a good way.

As it is you can literally build a home in minecraft in about a minute. TFC does a bit better with making dirt a non useful construction material but it's still a matter of about 5 to get some wood and set up a house. When I played with the intense weight limit I did not build a house fully within my first night, nor my second, nor my third. I blocked off a spot in the trees to a degree, but it was far from comfortable or safe. When I went to mine stone I could get about 5-8(don't recall) before I would have to offload it and the pacing felt absolutely PERFECT.

In the long run, this would ruin a game, if that was the only way to do things.

So that alone isn't good, but if we had better systems of transport it would absolutely make this much less of a problem. In Minecraft there are Minecarts, I've never met anyone who used them for mining. They're used for railways often, roller coasters every once in a while, bur I've never seen anyone decide it was an optimal way to mine. Because it isn't, when you can carry literally tonnes of stone, iron, armour and multiple trees worth of wood in your back pocket a minecart provides very little benefit.

But that shouldn't be the only method of transport, though it works for both overland and underground it'd be a hassle overseas, which is why I think Sailing Ships are a MUST. There have been a number of mods for MC that had them, though all propelled by magic. Ideally the engine this game is designed in would allow rutters, sails and propellers(gears, pulleys, ropes, weights, and such would also be on the list of dreams) and thus these could be designed by players to make them actually function as would be expected in a (close to)real world.

I also think Minecraft's square meters of material are much too large, and it would make a lot more sense from every front(not least of which is aesthetically) to have a smaller base size to the world. I do think TFC's Wooden Planks are brilliant, they really provide a feel of the real world to me and I'd like building systems designed more around that kind of thing, using processed materials to build.

Anyway, excuse my drunken ramblings, if anybody has anything they'd like to say or comment on feel free, I feel I should probably head

[Menoch 335]

......

...you feel you should probably head....

What the hell of how much have you been drinking, man!? Lmfao!!

Nice wall if rambling.

Personally I have lost my taste for mmorpgs. Nothing will ever beat EverQuest when it comes to bringing community together and offering one HELL of a challenge.

I do like Guild Wars 2. That has kinda rekindled an interest, but only slightly.

My opinion is that gamers (for the most part) want everything handed to them on a silver platter, with anything requiring work labeled "tedious" or "grinding".

What ever happened to the days of consequence and elbow grease!?

More game companies need to grow a set of noo noos and produce more games with grit and in your face rawness like Demon's Souls and EQ and stop littering the market with "0 to 60 in 2 days" mmo's. There are already more than two barge loads of that crap out there.

Personally, I have thought about reverting back to the good old days of board games (Runebound and Talisman) and pen and paper (Rifts and Cyberpunk). If this upcoming breath if new life being pumped into Shadowrun fails, I may have to go on haiatus from video games altogether!

And on that note... 2013 promises one hell of an addition to boardgame rpg's by your's truly. Keep an ear out!

GAME ON

[renadi 258]

What really pissed me off was Star Wars Galaxies which actually seemed to have a spine when it came out and then... just kinda slid it down out and threw it away. I honestly can't imagine the number of people who left that damn game... but maybe we're morons, and everybody else really does want exactly the same experience as everything else that's been on the market since WoW.

[Menoch 335]

Well then I'm a moron that likes his shaken, not stirred. I played SWG for about a week. :/

I miss the mmo communities of old. Even Dark Age of Camelot brought the communities together. I had such an awesome guild there. We stayed friends even years after we had all stopped playing.

GIVE US A GAME WITH NADS....

Oh what's the use. Until I have the cash, I may never see an mmorpg that I actually want to play again (GW2 Aside... not sure what it is about gw2 that I like so much...).

Even so, one mans vision isn't always a winning recipe. Look at 38 studios. What a kick ass team. Wtf happened there was a shame.

[renadi 258]

Ugh, yeah, I don't think I'll ever feel right about that.

I was really looking forward to what would come there.

I really like Kingdoms of Amalur.

OMG

There's a KoA mod for MC, it looks absolutely atrocious!

[Menoch 335]

Lol. Have you tried the terraria mod? Wasn't impressed, though kudos to anyone who can mod.

I really liked KoA also. I remember playing the demo over and over before the game came out. I think the side quests were fantastically written, though I wasn't too fond of crafting... it could have been done better, but overall the game was a gem.

It cost soooo much to make though. Regardless of having big-leaguers in his court, Kurt should have went the Indie route, saved money, got feedback after people actually played his game, and then chose his path. 38 studios would still be alive. I remember saying that when I heard what he was doing.

It really is a shame....

[renadi 258]

Yeah, it really seemed like the kind of project that a kickstarter could have helped, even if they still had to get some amount of a lone beforehand it may have been enough.

but who knows.

I didn't -hate- the terraria mod, I definitely feel even though it has better gameplay I will always come back to MC simply because I can build a house that is something other than pixel art.

[Walmart Germaphobe 15]

I love games where an attack hurts. I hate fast health regen and hit points. HP is bad because HP damage is too generic. What I would like is a graph of organs and vulnerable areas in the HUD that shows damage to body parts. there should also be a blood meter so keeping damage off the vitals is only part of it. Also, pain and shock should be a considerable factor. And food, water and sleep. I know this is a tall order, but I like my games to be believable. No background magic powers that regen, revive, or insta-heal, unless they take a large role in the game.

[renadi 258]

Exactly.

I like roguelikes mainly because the good ones have next to no health regen naturally and death is death is death.