Economy Ideas

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

I think you guys can just pick a random item and barter with it :/

[Jed1314 420]

I think you guys can just pick a random item and barter with it :/

You are probably right, I was asking for a coin purely because of the legitimacy it would lend the process. I could use fire charges or any manner of other things for coins, I'd just rather have coins from an immersion perspective. Still, if that is it then no problem

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

I think you guys can just pick a random item and barter with it :/

...but if it's the same random item every time, haven't we just made a fiat currency again? Lol.

[LtChae 13]

Might the impending implementation of village trading have some bearing on all this? Gems, gold, and silver could be used to trade for more useful goods at villages, giving players a way to "cash in" their currency. (At horrible rates, of course. Those villagers are awfully shifty...)

This would definitely benefit SP, by letting a player trade worthless (to him) gems for more useful materials.

[Lumireaver 101]

I think you guys can just pick a random item and barter with it :/

You're restricting creativity a teensy-weensy bit by attempting to assign an intristic value for money. Minecraft, particularly TFC, seems to be about building everything from scratch. This could easily extend to economies.

Bartering works in small communities, but the larger you get, the more disputes you might run into about what anything is worth. Also kingdom-sized servers would feel kind of off if they only deal with chickens.

Idea, in order to prevent (deter) counterfeiting it could be made so that coins could be minted from several metals. The first precious metal would determine the coin type with special combinations yielding alloy!coins. (The difference between a gold coin and an electrum coin would be the ratio of metals used?) After the first ingot, any number (with a reasonable limit) of ingots could be used to create the coins. (Total coin output = ingots used x XX) Unless the next batch of coins uses the same pattern of ingots they won't stack. Not so easy to spot/produce counterfeits.

Coins made of just one type of metal would be bullions. :U

PS Counterfeiting has been around for ages and has been punishable by death. I don't know how your server takes care of counterfeiters though... :U

[Jed1314 420]

-snip-

Thats an interesting solution to the counterfeiting issue. I have come up with my own solution for now (though I won't be able to set up my server till October time) which is to use vanilla gold ingots and nuggets as currency. I will set up an equivalent exchange of 10 nuggets = 1 ingot. Currency release in this system is slightly more complex, but it can be easily managed through the initial loans and subsequent purchases of user items etc.

In order to provide a "limiting factor" I will only generate gold at a rate I can buy it (where 1 TFC ingot = 1 vanilla), and will occasionally stockpile the gold and subsidise the purchase with my own funds. I'm thinking an initial spawning of around 50 ingots and 5000 nuggets, with a plot of land (or possibly some kind of mining licence) costing 250 nuggets. Players will need to take loans to fund their initial ventures in keeping with the lore of the server, which I am developing.

[Scooterdanny 285]

I like your idea jed, mostly because it is much in concurrence with one of mine XD but also because it reduces complexity, while maintaining a table fiat currency.

[lakeel 5]

I think you guys can just pick a random item and barter with it :/

just like gems >.> which are now even more worthless thx to sluices

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Maybe we could make minted coins be different per player, as in "this coin was minted by eternal" or something. (obviously, not so bluntly) but it would mean that as long as people only put a value on the properly minted coins, any one else's coins would be little more than pressed pieces of metal. This stops counterfeiting and problems with inflation as only coins made the server ops would be considered legitimate currency.

[EternalUndeath 1,208]

only coins made the server ops would be considered legitimate currency.

On your server, maybe.

'Legitimate currency' is determined by where it's accepted.

If the only currency used on a server is Minted Coin (Jed1341), but I decide to move and make another kingdom far away and people join me on it, then within the bounds of that kingdom, Minted Coin (Eternalundeath) is the currency of the realm, regardless of who's OP. It's all about who accepts what.

[bsb23 303]

and thus we now have a complex, multiple currency economy. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

[abandoned mines 119]

heres an example of a simple (yet fiendish) currency system

in the northwest during the 1930s, there was no work

people were penniless and starving, so people started taking jobs where ever they could

to keep costs down, and to keep people trapped working for them many companies released something called "company money"

company money works like this.

you have no way of leaving your area and have little real money

a company gives you a job in the middle of no where

the company runs all the amenities in a "company town"

to pay for goods and services in a company town of this form normal money won t work, so the company pays you in company money

this money only works at the company stores and is worthless elsewhere.

to keep people in the area (to basically trap them in the company town) many company's charged you massive fines for lateness, laxness and other small mistakes

at one location called the Anyox copper smelter, the workers were fined 5c MD (company dollar $ ) for every lunch break taken by workers.

this only worked as you had literally no were in the area to escape to...

the really bad bit is when these company's collapse, the workers from these jobs have no money to start again!!

just something i thought would fit in here, as it is a currency system and could work really well on massively large server maps.

(PS) does thinking this system is good make me a bad person ? because i really don t like work unions in my area ..

[abandoned mines 119]

and thus we now have a complex, multiple currency economy. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

not sure so long as we don t get the server equivalent of Americas wall street ....

[Scooterdanny 285]

Oooh, infinus, that IS dastardly, however in minecraft, essential needs are more easily fulfilled, but the multiple currencies could be a problem, unless A everyone wanted to stay in said area or B people from the opposing kingdom accepted currency (i would suggest at a very depreciated rate > so as to be sort of like a brokering firm.i could totally see that happening.

[GCountach 39]

I rather l like the idea of being able to mint coins but having the IGN of the minter tied to it. It would be the mint's choice to introduce or remove currency from the market. Multiple currencies in one server could be interesting, though it'd have to be pretty large "kingdoms" for currency conversion to be possible. I can see one town buying out another players coins from a different kingdom when they join their kingdom, then turning around and using those coins to purchase goods from the other kingdom. I could even see the rise in banking from the creation of "real" currency (as opposed to digital currency that most server economy mods use), as it'd be unsafe to store all your gold in your house if there's no chest protection.

Besides, I rather like the idea of buying charcoal stacks by the jeds.

[Scooterdanny 285]

Besides, I rather like the idea of buying charcoal stacks by the jeds.

O.o the amusing potential of that has just struck me... "well, i want 2 pigs," "hmm, i gotta charge ya 10 jeds" lol

[abandoned mines 119]

O.o the amusing potential of that has just struck me... "well, i want 2 pigs," "hmm, i gotta charge ya 10 jeds" lol

instead of the all mighty dollar ... all hail the Jed!!!!

now if only we could engrave phrases on money ...

btw i forgot to mention that back in the 30s there was something called the "ACT"

the "ACT" (alien currency tax) was imposed on all non native currency entering Canada

the rate was something like 25% to the dollar 0.o no wonder my country stayed in the economic dumps til WW2

no one would trade with Canada due to our high trade tariffs

one way to easily go to war with an enemy faction would be to put MASSIVE trade tariffs on any of there money within your country.

the enemy's money would go down in value as your countries allies currency's become worth more with the enemy money being worth less in the publics eye

btw if the above didn t make sense ..

the enemy money becomes less valued to the average person bartering as 1) its taxed into the ground 2) other currency's are easier to deal with and become more in-demand = you and your allies money becomes more valued as your enemy falls into a depression

man i should be a banker on wall street ...

[Scooterdanny 285]

But.... this all depends on having a server large enough for it, i for one, would love to have like an official server, that we could get all of us playing in

[abandoned mines 119]

But.... this all depends on having a server large enough for it, i for one, would love to have like an official server, that we could get all of us playing in

hmm.... *checks friends server space

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

Bioxx says economy is incoming, but no work has been done on it yet.

[abandoned mines 119]

i see there are coins in TFC all ready, though they serve no purpose yet ?

anyway the server my friends and i use (12 persons only) we use the company money system in each others industries

[Jed1314 420]

Well, that escalated quickly

As far as I can discern, I am now a currency, economies are incoming and Infinus told a story about horrible corporate practice

I would be so up for getting a server going I can put in a reasonable amount of money to get a decent sized server, that way we can hopefully see the economy work properly. As far as the coin minting idea went, I think tagging coins with the creators name is a great idea, as the "official" currency can be decided by the users. That way, you could (as Eternal said) have several different kingdoms, each with their own currency. Furthermore, this would enable a new kind of "warfare" between kingdoms in the form of economic struggles. Anyone who couldn't manage currency properly would quickly see their kingdom reduced to nothing :L

Also, re Countach's point about banking .. Yep that is what I love about solid currency. There are risks assosciated with simply having it :L I think I previously outlined this somewhere, but this is my vision for a server:

A server made of multiple islands and continents, each distinct from the other. Some places will have certain metals, others will have abundant farm life and the potential for agriculture, some places will be barren and desolate on the surface, but a treasure trove beneath. Each of these places will be owned by factions, not just kingdoms, but, potentially, democratic city states and communist blocs as well.

These factions would be in constant flux with one another, war, peace, alliance and trade. No man could be an island, so people would have to band together and trade with each other to get what they needed to survive. Occasionally, one faction might get very powerful and rule as an empire, but players have the power to plot and scheme a rebellion, stashing weapons armour and food for their chance to overthrow. Great roads would connect cities, vital to the trade between them. Trade would be risky. Players could choose to abandon civilization and become bandits, forming roving bands of criminals, who raid and ambush traders. Politics would come into play, did the other city hire those bandits to harm the trade between two allies ?

War would be on a grand scale. Battles could be pre-arranged on server forums and fought between groups of factions. There could possibly even be sieges. If large, deadly, rare monsters were implemented, towns might band together to kill them, as happened with Smaug. Prehaps there could be DF style HFS (happy fun stuff, some kind of huge, deadly set of creatures I am yet to encounter) which could desolate a kingdom if freed from their subterranean prisons, needing alliances to stop them I think it would be EPIC

[barkingnoise 19]

Player-minted currency is a great idea, but I also think currency should be able to be "re-smelted" into raw materials. That way, should a currency-minter become unavailable to the server or simply stop playing and the currency fall into being worth nothing, the materials can be re-used.

Of course, this creates a problem with making the raw materials a potential currency in itself (which I don't really oppose), unless there is some loss in material when "re-smelting" the currency (making it unprofitable to simply convert it back)

The point I'm trying to make is basically that unless currency can be converted back into raw materials - regardless of loss as long as it yields something back - then we could easily end up with large stacks of USELESS currency, unless someone chooses to adopt it (which wouldn't really be practical as it is not reproducible, and having a list of all sorts of various approved currency even if the various currency in circulation doesn't exceed, say, 100 jeds, would be very confusing and not really realistic when talking about pre-paperpressprinting economies), nobody would be able to use.

Having it "re-smeltable" would also enable the concept of having large stacks of buried/hidden treasure in currency that is actually worth something. Say that infinius plays on the server, plays and mines alone, builds a hidden base, makes a lot of currency, stashes it and stops playing. Someone somewhere might stumble into his stash and proclaim "I've found treasure belonging to someone called infinius!"

It could perpetuate legends if done right.

[abandoned mines 119]

hmm ...

i like where the above went

can t wait to see some economic wars on servers

small poor democratic nation and a socialist nation VS the communist bloc country's

[Jed1314 420]

hmm ...

i like where the above went

can t wait to see some economic wars on servers

small poor democratic nation and a socialist nation VS the communist bloc country's

Haha "The Battle of Our Time", the biggest question ever asked will be answered by minecraft .. Which system is best ? :L