Alloys Like Meals

[Vlad 73]

Idea picked from the All Seeing Eye, and made into a bigger one.

The idea is to make is possible to combine any metals into alloys, and it will work similar to the meals.

First we redefine what is metal, it's not just bronze or copper, but how much of each base metal it has:

Bronze - 75% copper, 25% tin, 0% all the others

So that way you can get TONS of different alloys like:

Golden iron - 66% gold, 34% iron

Zinc brass - 50% zinc, 50% copper

Add what ever comes your mind

How this new alloy will look like? What it's meting points?

An alloy will be represented be the most close metal/alloy, for example Golden iron will still be gold and zinc brass will be brass.

The function that determine what metal/alloy is the most close to the alloy can be really simple like sum of differences to each known in game base metals, or something more complicated..

Now it's the part where meals come in.

A certain range of alloys gets different bonuses:

50-80% iron and 20-30% copper - durability +50%

70-100% silver or 50-100% gold - speed +100%

Like the meals it's all predefined (by random) for each world and you should try and play with it to find what useful combinations there is (even when you get a bonus you don't know what are the requirements for this, so here you try and play again).

I believe this idea has a lot of potential for multiplier as well.

Some blacksmith found out that an alloy made from 5% gold, 15% silver, 30% tin and 50% iron is creating a metal similar to iron but with double durability and speed

It's going to explode the field of smiting without adding any ores or alloys

Hope this idea won't get lost

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

Some blacksmith found out that an alloy made from 5% gold, 15% silver, 30% tin and 50% iron is creating a metal similar to iron but with double durability and speed

.. So, 100% of iron is weaker and slower than 110% of iron + other metals? WHAT SORCERY IS THIS?!

(About the suggestion? sounds... moderate don't know what will Dunk and Bioxx think about it, though...)

[renadi 258]

I don't know how I feel about this.

On one hand, ideally in my mind, ores would have no name until given one by a player and their properties and alloys would be random(or chosen out of a set) and discovered through experimentation.

However as it is we have ores at least based on real world equivalents, and this system would be odd in that context.

Edit: JAG that's how you get the double durability and speed, it's ultradense blackholealloy magics!!!

blackholealloy sounds dirty.

Edited 19 Nov 2012 by renadi

[bsb23 303]

Not a bad idea you have a couple problems though. Metals would need to get a huge list of attributes that way we could tell if they could be used for something. That isn't as easy as it sounds as far as I know. Items would need a color variable so that we could change them based on their metals, same with their blocks. Next, I'm sorry but we can't use a basic average + percentage idea it needs to be a little more complex than that and believable. Like JAG says it hardly makes sense.

[renadi 258]

I don't think we need specific numbers, I hardly expect Dunk or Bioxx would want them, very rarely does any developer from what I've seen, this is a game changing idea that would need a LOT of refinement obviously, judging on the merit of numbers I think is a bit unfair.

the idea itself however I think can certainly stand without them.

[ECC 508]

Can we just remove the meal system altogether? so many threads popping up with 'this just like meals' :/

personally, the ONLY way I can say yes to this is if we implement theoretical alloys. only those, and those alone have secret seed based recipes. anything reexisting stays the same, but if you want... mythral for example, you must go though a dozen recipes, waste tons of metal, then suddenly, when you have wasted your life away, lost your spouse, you house, everything, you find it... and rub it in everyone's face ;D

[renadi 258]

Personally I'd prefer shedding the 'real' recipes we have or nothing at all, mixing the two systems would just... leave a bad taste in my mouth.

[Vlad 73]

--delete--

[Vlad 73]

Just to say, I don't see why it's hard to implement and even simple.

I'm just disappointed the people seams to misunderstand me

.. So, 100% of iron is weaker and slower than 110% of iron + other metals? WHAT SORCERY IS THIS?!

(About the suggestion? sounds... moderate don't know what will Dunk and Bioxx think about it, though...)

110%?

What we in Russia?

Anyway, if you combine iron + copper you get 2 alloys that are 50% iron 50% copper, there is no loss here.

Same as with meals: apple + peach + steak = nothing special, but if you add olive you get strength 4

Not a bad idea you have a couple problems though. Metals would need to get a huge list of attributes that way we could tell if they could be used for something. That isn't as easy as it sounds as far as I know. Items would need a color variable so that we could change them based on their metals, same with their blocks. Next, I'm sorry but we can't use a basic average + percentage idea it needs to be a little more complex than that and believable. Like JAG says it hardly makes sense.

So I see people are missing my point

Iron is still iron even if the alloy is 90% iron and 10% silver, but same as with meals that could make a huge difference.

Also like with meals alloys won't only show you they name but what they made from: 50% iron ...

NOTHING is going to change the game now, only add, you still can make steel and red or blue..

This only adds buffs like with meals.

Can we just remove the meal system altogether? so many threads popping up with 'this just like meals' :/

personally, the ONLY way I can say yes to this is if we implement theoretical alloys. only those, and those alone have secret seed based recipes. anything reexisting stays the same, but if you want... mythral for example, you must go though a dozen recipes, waste tons of metal, then suddenly, when you have wasted your life away, lost your spouse, you house, everything, you find it... and rub it in everyone's face ;D

Same same

No you do not waste anything, and all the metals/alloys you have now are stay as they are, no new metals pop up and you don't need to worry about it.

Think of it as of cups with juices, you can apple , orange and peach juices,

if you combine apple with orange you get 2 cups of 50% apple and 50% orange, you didn't loss anything except now you can't have your apple juice

I don't think we need specific numbers, I hardly expect Dunk or Bioxx would want them, very rarely does any developer from what I've seen, this is a game changing idea that would need a LOT of refinement obviously, judging on the merit of numbers I think is a bit unfair.

the idea itself however I think can certainly stand without them.

I not sure this is a bad place for numbers, the buffs I suggested are going to be in ranges, so anything between 10-20 will suit., so no worry about anything specipic.

I really made sure nothing is going to change in the game,

also if it's really scary to see the number, we can make them hidden and let you rename the alloy you created.

I don't know how I feel about this.

On one hand, ideally in my mind, ores would have no name until given one by a player and their properties and alloys would be random(or chosen out of a set) and discovered through experimentation.

However as it is we have ores at least based on real world equivalents, and this system would be odd in that context.

Edit: JAG that's how you get the double durability and speed, it's ultradense blackholealloy magics!!!

blackholealloy sounds dirty.

The most close metal (black steel for example) is going to decide the base stats for the alloy, from they you might get some buffs.

So basically try all you want red/blue are still the best, unless you will create something similar to them with buffs.

[ECC 508]

what I was saying is that you waste metals in making USELESS ALLOYS. by making a useless alloy, you have wasted materials that you can not reuse.

[Vlad 73]

what I was saying is that you waste metals in making USELESS ALLOYS. by making a useless alloy, you have wasted materials that you can not reuse.

Here we go again

You didn't create a useless alloy, maybe it has no buffs but it doesn't making it useless (do you have any buffs now?)

Example:

you have 9 iron and 1 copper

combining then will result in 10 alloys that are 90% iron and 10% copper

The closest similar metal is iron

Therefor it's still iron (but with a little copper)

And it will acts EXACTLY like iron, (maybe it even earned some bonuses..)

you lost something? NO

you earned because now you have more iron.

And no, you can't convert any metal into iron

by using to much copper you are gonna get copper instead of iron.

Again you can think of juices:

by combining apple juice with water

you get more apple juice as long as you don't add too much to make it just water

same with metals:

adding some copper into iron wont ruin it.. but make it bigger, as long as there is enough iron, it's gonna act similar to one

[Treyflix 277]

How dare you suggest we change the Metal system! It's perfect! Don't tell us to change just because you have a rev- ohh, wait...

I am going out on a limb here and whole-heartingly support Vlad, Kimble, & co.'s idea. For some strange reason you are all attacking it when to me it seems to be a great "Diamond in the Rough" suggestion. Sure the numbers and percentages need to be balanced, but while not exactly original (based completely off of the [brilliant] Meals system) it is a rather intriguingly delicious idea for a exceptionally organic system. Vlad seems to be right in that this would create the perfect niche for a proper blacksmith.

I don't get it, whats not to like?

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

110%?

What we in Russia?

5%+15%=30%

30%+30%=60%

60%+50%=110%

Look at the last spoiler in your first post in this thread (or the OP; however you prefer to call it...)

[dunkleosteus 2,425]

-__- no.

alloys aren't like meals where the quality depends on the person. It's either strong or it isn't. alloying gold and iron would be like combining two useful things into something horrible. Imagine a Ferrari and the tractor off a big rig. One is highly functional, able to pull huge loads.The other looks awesome but can never be used to haul cargo. Now combine them. What do you get? A mutilation of nature, an ugly-ass tractor with the torque of a tricycle.

[Leosallespoli 338]

5%+15%=30%

30%+30%=60%

60%+50%=110%

Look at the last spoiler in your first post in this thread (or the OP; however you prefer to call it...)

not necessarily, most economist would pay someone to hit for saying that.

[Treyflix 277]

5%+15%=30%

30%+30%=60%

60%+50%=110%

Look at the last spoiler in your first post in this thread (or the OP; however you prefer to call it...)

I'm sorry JAG, but I believe you math is flawed.

"Some blacksmith found out that an alloy made from 5% gold, 15% silver, 30% tin and 50% iron is creating a metal similar to iron but with double durability and speed ."

5+15=20

20+30=50

50+50=100.

Zing!

Edit: This thread has been; Slam Dunked!

*ba dum tiss*

[Kimbblesrath 503]

I'm sorry JAG, but I believe you math is flawed.

"Some blacksmith found out that an alloy made from 5% gold, 15% silver, 30% tin and 50% iron is creating a metal similar to iron but with double durability and speed ."

5+15=20

20+30=50

50+50=100.

Zing!

Edit: This thread has been; Slam Dunked!

*ba dum tiss*

Have you seen that Dunk meme?

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

I'm sorry JAG, but I believe you math is flawed.

"Some blacksmith found out that an alloy made from 5% gold, 15% silver, 30% tin and 50% iron is creating a metal similar to iron but with double durability and speed ."

5+15=20

20+30=50

50+50=100.

Zing!

Edit: This thread has been; Slam Dunked!

*ba dum tiss*

The first time i made the maths when about to sleep, and now i made it when i just woke up. Don't judge me in my worst moments... :

[LordOfWolves 514]

The first time i made the maths when about to sleep, and now i made it when i just woke up. Don't judge me in my worst moments... :

Damn you're a god. How can you make certain mistakes?

[Treyflix 277]

Have you seen that Dunk meme?

Of course! I am a HUGE fan of the Dunk memes. Hope to contribute some time

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

Damn you're a god. How can you make certain mistakes?

I'm a god of derailments, and i can't make mistakes while derailing. I'm not a god of maths (even though most of the times i'm good at it ), and therefore can make mistakes on it.

[Vlad 73]

-__- no.

alloys aren't like meals where the quality depends on the person. It's either strong or it isn't. alloying gold and iron would be like combining two useful things into something horrible. Imagine a Ferrari and the tractor off a big rig. One is highly functional, able to pull huge loads.The other looks awesome but can never be used to haul cargo. Now combine them. What do you get? A mutilation of nature, an ugly-ass tractor with the torque of a tricycle.

Of course

Because cherry, steak and bread, are gonna make you stronger, but adding an apple to this meal is going to remove this effect..

It's not like I'm going to force you the use this idea, but I do like you to use it, it's amazing

[Kimbblesrath 503]

Of course! I am a HUGE fan of the Dunk memes. Hope to contribute some time

Shhh...Talk Quietly...Dunk HATES the Dunk memes. Let's practice them in secret..Like a cult..

[LordOfWolves 514]

Shhh...Talk Quietly...Dunk HATES the Dunk memes. Let's practice them in secret..Like a cult..

You forgot that Dunk is a mod, true? He can see everything and everyone and he can permanently ban who suggests a cookiehammer.

[Just_Another_Guy_:) 1,066]

Arguing with a dev about one of the features of his mod...

Now THAT'S a bad idea :